View Full Version : Clevelands on J3

12-14-2017, 07:51 AM
My J3 had the Cleveland brakes and 600-6 tires put on prior to my purchasing the aircraft 1 1/2 years ago. I am considering getting rid of the Clevelands and 600-6s and going back to a more original look with the Groves and 800-4s. I have also considered putting 8.50-6s on and keeping the Clevelands as this is allowed for with the STC.

Does anyone have any ideas on this one way or another?


12-14-2017, 09:02 AM
All depends on the look and authenticity desired. When I purchased my -11, Cory expressed a desire to put it back on small tires for the same reason. I on the other hand went off the deep end and put 29's on it. But I also don't land on pavement and mowed grass is often not the case either.

If you decide to go back to groves, there is a resale market for the Clevelands with guys like me.


12-14-2017, 09:31 AM
I installed Clevelands on my 11 as soon as I got it home. Two reasons: I wanted brakes and I wanted larger tires. On the other hand I could care less about “original appearance”.

I would imagine that the Grove wheels and brakes may provide decent braking. But would I ever go from Cleveland’s back to 4 inch wheels. Nope.

But this is a purely personal choice. If you’re really concerned about that original look, the Groves May be for you. I can’t think of any operational advantage.


Cub junkie
12-14-2017, 12:34 PM
When you take the 800x4's off a J3 its no longer a J3.

12-14-2017, 12:44 PM
800x4 tires seem pretty spendy.
Desser has two types available--
new ribbed GY's at $304 each,
and retread smoothies @ 460.

https://www.desser.com/pc_combined_results.asp?pc_id=D3ECF29F85FC419CB238 79D8A011A8B0&search_keyword=&opts=SHOP+BY+AIRCRAFT~opt1%3DPiper%7Copt2%3DJ3%7Co pt3%3DMAIN%7Copt4%3DTIRES%3B&faceted_search_terms=SHOP+BY+AIRCRAFT~8778DBA381B0 45D2B00F6842C72FC74B

bob turner
12-14-2017, 02:10 PM
The tires and tubes are hideously expensive. Th more of us who go back to original tires, the cheaper they get, in theory.

I run Grove and 8:00x4 because I think a J-3 loses its J-3ness with stupid looking tires - but 8:00x6 comes reasonably close if you want to cheap out.

As for brakes - the Grove caliper is pretty much identical (and interchangeable) with the 30-19 Cleveland, used on my much heavier Decathlon, the 201 Mooney, and the Cherokee Arrow. What's not to stop?

12-14-2017, 02:32 PM
There is a J3 here with Cleveland wheels and 8.00x6 tires. It is not unattractive or weird looking and maintenance is less expensive. Find some worn out tires, put 'em on your wheels, and see how you like the looks before you spend the money. Tires are a preventive maintenance item so you can do it yourself.

12-14-2017, 09:58 PM
IMHO a Cub (of any flavor) looks pretty good on 850x6's.

12-14-2017, 10:01 PM
IMHO a Cub (of any flavor) looks pretty good on 850x6's.
Agreed. Get the Desser 8.50-6 / 4 ply smooth tread.

bob turner
12-14-2017, 10:29 PM
8:50s are almost as expensive as the 8:00x4. Usually those who go Cleveland (since the Grove STC) want to save $. We get three times as many landings on the expensive Goodyears compared to normal 6:00x6.

One of the guys runs 8:50s on his Cub with double puck brakes and stock masters. He is very happy. Those wheels and tires add a lot of weight; not a problem in SoCal.

I am definitely not a purist - my stripe is red, my bear is too big, my yellow is too dark, and my intrument panel is "different". My personal Cub will have Cub wheels and tires for the duration.

12-15-2017, 12:59 AM
Probably use tires best suited to what you’re doing.

J3’s love big ol’ soft 29’s...! ABW Airstreaks.

12-15-2017, 07:28 AM
Nothing stock about my J-3 / PA-11 / PA-18.... Some guy asked me once why I would do that (all the mods) to a cub. I said because it’s mine and I wanted to.... also got asked why I had 2 airplanes. Told him because I can’t afford 3..... I’ll give a report on my Desser smooth 8:50’s in a few weeks...

12-15-2017, 07:56 AM
Nothing stock about my J-3 / PA-11 / PA-18.... Some guy asked me once why I would do that (all the mods) to a cub. I said because itís mine and I wanted to.... also got asked why I had 2 airplanes. Told him because I canít afford 3..... Iíll give a report on my Desser smooth 8:50ís in a few weeks...

Same here I have my 850s in the shop and Grove says my wheels and brakes are on the way

12-15-2017, 12:25 PM
8:50s are almost as expensive as the 8:00x4. ....

FWIW here's Desser's prices for:
Goodyear 800x4 ... $304
Airtrac 4-ply 800x6...$162
Airtrac 6-ply 850x6...$239
smoothie 4-ply 850x6...$250

09-02-2018, 06:42 PM
I have decided to go back to the 800-4 wheels and tires on my J3. Parts on on the way so I would expect to be selling the Cleveland brakes, wheels and the air hawk 600-6 tires here in the next couple weeks. Anyone interested?386473864838649

About 80 hours or so on them since new. $2200

bob turner
09-02-2018, 10:40 PM
You are doing the right thing. Those are ugly, and few Cubs need double puck brakes. My Decathlon has original Clevelands with single puck discs, and the parts actually are identical to the 8:00x4 Grove brakes. These same brakes stop Mooney 201s and Cherokee retractables, so they must be ok for a little J-3.

Most of the big tire Cubs around here land exclusively on pavement. It is an appearance thing, which is ok as long as the performance hit is understood.

I have to note - I am pretty critical of folks who use “ apostrophe s” for plural. The iPad spell checker just did that to me. “Cleveland’s,” as in things the city owns, when I meant a “pair” of Cleveland brakes.

01-06-2020, 10:39 PM
Is an STC required for 8.50-6 tires on J3? Asking for a friend.

Gordon Misch
01-06-2020, 10:54 PM
Is an STC required for 8.50-6 tires on J3? Asking for a friend.Check the TCDS. Or Bob Turner would know.

01-06-2020, 11:00 PM
Good point sir. Yeah, not mentioned in the TC so I guess STC or 337.

bob turner
01-07-2020, 12:24 AM
STC for 6:00 wheels, probably a field approval for the 8:50s. Grove now has a 6:00 wheel that is legal for any tire up to 26". Grove is usually less expensive (new) than Cleveland.

go here: two different strengths - lighter ones for J3. Approved.


01-07-2020, 11:02 AM
Thanks for posting the link, Bob.
Nice looking stuff.
Interesting that they offer two different weight ratings on the kits--
dunno the differences but FWIW they seem to be the same price:
1-1/4" or 1/1/2" axle, aluminum or magnesium: $2099.
Nice that the STC includes approval for tires up to 26x10.5-6.

FWIW the comparable Cleveland 199-71STC kit is $2753,
mag wheels & 1-14" axle only, & approved only for 600, 700, & 800 tires.

bob turner
01-07-2020, 12:24 PM
Yeah. I think Cleveland wants to buy Grove out. Airplanes are Robbie's hobby and passion. All our Cubs are Grove-equipped. I hold field approvals for Aeronca installations as well as J3 and Super Cub master cylinders. Brake pedals are always in the same spot. I check fluid yearly.