The Sport of Pilots

[RedEye]

If being a pilot is a sport does that mean we're athletes ?? Never pictured guys like Cajun Joe or Massey as athletes ! Interesting !

Lowflybye,

Thanks for shedding some light on this subject, even though its a tough crowd around here! Someone said "I just want to fly my little airplane around the countryside" . Amen !! The days when you hit the neighbors fence while landing and simple wanted to help fix the fence instead of seeing if he has insurance to pay for your mistake are gone !! And its sad !! I've been doing the juggling act with medicals and insurance now for 3 years. And it certainly is no fun for a simple guy that just wants fly around the countryside. What ever happened to the proposal of a self-medical for a third-class ? When I dont feel good enough to fly, I simply dont, but I certainly dont call the FAA to let them know that I'm not well enough to fly today. Be it the flu or pneumonia or whatever. Its a shame that we are all grouped together in this. I rarely fly into populated areas or airports, let alone a towered airport, yet I'm looked at in the same light as those that do. Seems there should be some consideration for that ?? Just venting on a frustrating situation !!!! :x

I just want to fly !!! :-? I'm addicted as you say !!!

 

[HydroCub]

To make matters more complicated, the FAA just issued an opinion that a non-night current CFI could fly at night with a non-night current pilot while the pilot makes landings and takeoffs to get night current. Go figure..!!

Hello Hydro,

I'm interested in this opinion. Do you know where I could find it? Thanks.

Hank

check your PM

 

[jnorris]

Thanks Joe...I was beginning to feel like a lone wolf here.

No problem. I don't like to see inaccurate information stated as "fact" any more than the next guy. And since I am talking about this sport pilot stuff on a daily basis I've pretty much come across about every version of "fact" that you can think of. I do my best to keep people on the right track.

But don't work too hard at patting me on the back. I really didn't like the way you presented the article. I agree with those that thought the tone of the article bordered on "scare tactics". But that's just perception. Perception is much like opinion (and belly buttons) - everybody has one.

I haven't yet found anything in the article that is technically incorrect from an insurance standpoint, although I am having a friend of mine who's in the insurance industry look at it to make sure I didn't miss anything. I just would have used a different approach to present the subject. Again, personal opinion.

The bottom line is, insurance is something a pilot should be thinking about when making the decision to switch over to sport pilot operations. It may or may not be an issue, depending on who the policy is worded. As with all things, forewarned is forearmed. Don't just assume that you can make the switch without having to worry about the issue.

Cheers!

 

[Clyde and Susan]

O.K. Just one more time. First of all I apologize for acting like an authority on the matters in question which I am not. I have been published in some national magazines, and many house organs both military and civilian. The other night after reading the article (I did read it more than once), it really teed me off and your rebuttals didn't do anything to lower my blood pressure either.

I am insured and my current insurance company knows that I now fly as a Sport Pilot with my commercial certificate and that my wife has a sport pilot's certificate and although she has a third class medical, she is not required to do so. We both have current biannual reviews. Susan has flown over 300 hours safely now as a sport pilot and I have flown about 500 hours safely as a sport pilot since my last medical has expired. The cost of the policy did not increase appreciably. I would not even consider lying to the insurance company, there is too much at stake.

Programs such as the Young Eagles and other EAA sponsored programs are aimed at interesting more young folks in aviation. I just don't like to see anything in print that will scare them away. I think that your article could have been written in a more friendly way while still explaining the facts from the point of view of the insurance companies. I don't think the article as written is complimentary to your business or to aviation in general.

Again, I apologize for the tone of my initial response to your article. I am sure you spent a lot of time writing it and it is your baby. I think it will be interesting to see the "letters to the editor" after the article is published. If I can find it, I will buy a copy. ...Clyde

 

[Scouter]

Lowfly:

I have a couple questions you or Joe can answer. Is all the above discussion what EAA and AOPA argued for in pushing sport pilot? I was under the initial impression sport was designed around the idea that flying would be less expensive, would generated more student starts, and generally make flying more accesible to more people. Seems like the sport flying community is partly filled with folks who cant pass a medical, and are using sport to hide behind to keep flying. I know of more than a few guys who cant pass either a vision test, have some underlying heart conditions,etc etc who are happily flying sport. I have had endless arguments with my diabetic brother who said he can fly sport pilot. My point is he has a pre existing condition that will disqualifiy him, unless he jumps thru some hoops. Isnt poor vision,previous heart problems, stroke all the same kind of idea? Im sure not the one to say they shouldnt be flying, but I scratch my head when a PA11 suddenly was worth $20K more than is was because a retiree who cant see can still fly.
I will probably be there myself one day as well.

Jim

 

[S2D]

Item 7

PILOTS: The policy shall not apply while the aircraft is in flight unless the pilot in command is any of the following:

PART C: Any person holding a currently effective certificate issued by the Federal Aviation Administration designating him or her a private, commercial or airline transport pilot …

This is the part a good agent will discuss with any client that is insuring an aircraft meeting the sport pilot requirements.

failure to do so would be negligent of the agent.

I've had my fair share of insurance salesmen trying to sell me insurance that wouldn't cover me.

Try getting medical insurance as a cropduster.

I appreciate your bringing this to our attention LFB. But I still think an unsuspecting client would have a good case against the insurance company if the accident could be proven to be unrelated to any medical condition..

 

[Chuck-Fairfax]

Scouter,
Your issues have been discussed here and elsewhere for quite a while. It was never the intent of the FAA that a person operating under sport pilot regulations be able to pass a FAA 3rd Class or higher medical exam. Quite the contrary, and it is clear in the regulation and explanations the FAA has made.

The vision test is that required to be able to drive a car. If the folks you mention can't pass a vision test, they probably should be off the highway also.

We are not hiding behind anything. We are flying in accordance with the FAA regulations. I agree that there is not a clear-cut definition of some of the health problems that could or should keep a person from flying under sport pilot rules. The recommendation from FAA, EAA, and AOPA is see your own doctor to see if he believes you are OK to fly. Alright, he is probably not an AME, and may know nothing about flying, but at least it is a sanity check.

And of course, all of us have to make an assessment before every flight, regardless of medical certificate, as to our fitness to make the flight.
Chuck Shaw

 

[Lowflybye]

Lowfly:

I have a couple questions you or Joe can answer. Is all the above discussion what EAA and AOPA argued for in pushing sport pilot? I was under the initial impression sport was designed around the idea that flying would be less expensive, would generated more student starts, and generally make flying more accessible to more people. Seems like the sport flying community is partly filled with folks who cant pass a medical, and are using sport to hide behind to keep flying.
Jim

I think the intent of the EAA & AOPA was to make it more affordable and generate new interest in flying and to extend the flying years for older pilot, but I do not think it has succeeded in doing so the way they thought it would. This is purely opinion on my part. If it was designed to make it more affordable and bring new people in then why does a new LSA cost 6 figures and why is the list of "cheaper" LSA qualifying (J3, Champ, etc) aircraft not more encompassing? Where is the savings? Where is the cost benefit in buying a 6 figure aircraft that is limited to Sport Pilot rules? If I was going to spend that kind of money on an aircraft I would just get the full blown certificate. I think the Sport Pilot has become more of a tool for those who could already afford to fly, but have come to the point in their life where a medical has become an issue. Again this is just my opinion and I have nothing against it...like I said I will fall into that category someday if it allows me to fly longer, but it is the reason for the trepidation from the insurance companies.

I can tell you (factually) that about 90% of the Sport Pilot requests for insurance that I receive are from "older" pilots looking to continue on without a medical. I very rarely get a call from the 20 - 50 year old generation looking to operate under the Sport Pilot rules. I am sure that there are those out there in that age range, but I just do not get those calls very often.

 

[Scouter]

From the FAA website:



Sport Pilot Medical Certification-Frequently Asked Questions
Provided I otherwise qualify and have never sought FAA medical certification, am I authorized to exercise sport pilot privileges on the basis of a current and valid driver’s license if I have a chronic medical condition such as diabetes?

Response by the Federal Air Surgeon
You should consult your private physician to determine whether you have a medical deficiency that would interfere with the safe performance of sport piloting duties. You may exercise sport pilot privileges provided you are in good health, your medical condition is under control, you adhere to your physician’s recommended treatment, and you feel satisfied that you are able to conduct safe flight operations.
faa.gov Tools


Looks like my diabetic brother has spent more time researching than I have. Some good reading on the Faa website.

Jim

 

[redrooster]

Low Fly-by:
I read your article and all the resulting posts, generally negative, that followed. I thought the article was well thought out and well presented. My impression is that it was cautionary but not by any means scare tactics. It just makes a very good point that if you're gonna fly as a sport pilot, to check your policy and/or better yet talk to your insurance provider to make sure you're still covered operating without an FAA medical. i don't think I'd change a word.

Rooster

 

[Lippy]

Lowflybye- Aviation, more so then any other sport, has by comparison, the greatest percentage of armchair quarterbacks. Unfortunately I, as others previously posting probably qualify. This is difficult to admit but true for nearly all pilots. With that said, Cub and float plane pilots are probably worse then any other group in aviation for this quality, or lack there of. We (me included) are some of the most independent thinking people in North America. Does it surprise you that after your posting all Hell broke loose? Don't take it personal.

On the day of my first “supposedly legal” solo, I flew the J-3 from the farm to the airport to meet my instructor, the late Steve Kurtz. I walked into his office alone and he asked if I brought anybody with me. I replied that I hadn’t. His response was, “Give me your log book for me to sign. If you got here ok, I’m sure you can get home!” Do we always make the low risk decisions? No. Do we need to independently analyze personal risk? Yes. Do we always need someone telling us what that is? Sometimes we just need to take the bull by the horns to get the job done…

Lippy

 

[RedEye]

If being a pilot is a sport does that mean we're athletes ?? Never pictured guys like Cajun Joe or Massey as athletes !

Well???? No comment ????

 

[kase]

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