Buying a PA-11

[Bootlake]

Hello,
I am in the process of buying a really nice PA-11 with Flaps in Wasilla. It was built by Wick air in 94. Super clean. It was advertised as being a little on the heavy side. 980# is this something to worry about. It has heavy duty Gear and cabane. 18 tail and just about all the cub mods you could put on it. Any thoughts from PA-11 guys would be great!! I have heard great things about wicks and the work they do.

 

[articfox]

pa-11

Howdy there.
I had the same issue. Here is what I found.

That cub is a nice little cub. Some of the pa-11 specials built from j-3's went to 1350# as advertised in the type certificate. Some stayed at 1220 some at 1320 and add 100# for floats. The only problem really is flying overweight (according to the cert. gross wt.) is that a problem? Yes, if you get caught. Otherwise, fly the crap out of that little wonder. You won't be over with just you and some gas, right? So, if you do a bunch of your flying alone, no problem. If you want to bring a buddy along you will be (probably) overweight. The plane will fly good. A little tail low at the gross wt. but it still flys good. So, I know a number of folks that like the 11 but when the empty wt. goes up, it is a problem and therefore choose a plane with a better gross wt. They will go with a experimental or a 12, 14, 16 and so on or a beat up cub that draws the same price. Personally, I would go with the 11 and fly light or just lighten the thing up a little. Hopefully that helps a little. I by no means am a expert on anything except spending money on broken airplane parts.

 

[Douten]

mine was 902 with 25x11x4 tires I felt like that was a lot but you can load it up and it flies great, to on wheels about 150' has extended wings,sc trim and elevator controls, flap kit welded in with no flaps c-90-8 will get off as good or better than most super cubs but don't have the legal gross and it knows when it's loaded.

 

[RobS]

What engine and prop combo do you have? Ditto what the previous folks said. I'd be interested specifically who has the 1350 GWt paperwork That is very handy.

 

[Bootlake]

pa-11

C90 420 hrs, Auto STC, 5 gph, 75X37 McCauley borer prop .

 

[cubdriver2]

Mine was 790lbs with a 90-8 with a prop that would let it turn over 2600 on TO, get in the back seat solo and it would out climb almost everything, find a lite one and you won't be disapointed, power to weight that's what it's all about.

Glenn

 

[RobS]

What is your max static rpm? I used to have a C90 with a sensenich seaplane prop with a 37 pitch that rapped out at 2350. Now I have a an 0-200 with a McCauley 75X35 that hits max static rpm for the 0-200. For TO and climb the 0-200 and McCauley outperformed the C90, but not by much. Not sure if anyone cruises as slow as I do, generally about 75 on 29" tires and 2350 rpm. Not much real difference in cruise between 2250 and 2400. My paperwork shows 865 lbs empty and its flapless. From what I've been told by those that fly with flaps its nice on landing.

 

[Bootlake]

I guess what concerns me most is If you have a plane that almost weighs 890# you add a 210 pound guy...If you fill both tanks 36 gallons...you are over gross. Is this as big of an issue as I think it is? Now what about survival gear? Passenger surely isnt an option. How much weight did the Flap mod add. Does anyone know how much flaps add to the wings?

 

[Douten]

I would guess the flap mod in the plane (pully brackets only) was about 5 pounds or so, I have a Mac 7144 on now my other prop is a Mac 7440, I haven't tried it yet with the amphibs but I like it more than the 7144, going to try a Mac 7535 to try and get the RPM's up a little more for the seaplane. With full fuel 17 gals no wind and 80 degree at 700' ASL alone I get off in about 450'. I had a 235 guy in the back and slight breeze was less than 600'. Like Glenn said light is nice. Hey Glenn I agreed with you. Are you getting fuel in Rangeley on the way up?

 

[cubdriver2]

I would guess the flap mod in the plane (pully brackets only) was about 5 pounds or so, I have a Mac 7144 on now my other prop is a Mac 7440, I haven't tried it yet with the amphibs but I like it more than the 7144, going to try a Mac 7535 to try and get the RPM's up a little more for the seaplane. With full fuel 17 gals no wind and 80 degree at 700' ASL alone I get off in about 450'. I had a 235 guy in the back and slight breeze was less than 600'. Like Glenn said light is nice. Hey Glenn I agreed with you. Are you getting fuel in Rangeley on the way up?

You know I am, I have a .80 cent credit remember

Glenn

 

[cubdriver2]

Bootlake, what does it weigh, in your first post it's 980lb in your last it's 890lb, you and I either went to the same school or you already got rid of 100lbs :lol:

Glenn

 

[Roger Peterson]

My 11 weighs 980# and with floats on I gross out as high as 2000 and it gets off the water fine. Fly it from Texas to Canada each year. Don't like real hot days though. Kind of a dog when the weather hits 90 deg at that weight.

 

[Paul Heinrich]

There you go, another reason not to buy a used plane -- you never know how badly it was beat by the former owner(s).

 

[AkRoger]

Hey Ben there is a pacer out of Tok for about the same price and you can carry alot more. :evil:

 

[RobS]

The reason I ask about the prop is I don't think its legal on a C90. It is always nice to know a head of time on these things. My McCauley data sheet shows the following as legal: Continental C-90 1A90/CF, 1B90/CH, 1B90/CM Max to minimum length is 73 to 69 ½ inches. The 7535 is a great prop though. The 11 even at 980 with one guy, full fuel and gear is a nice plane. When you start trying to be a poor man's supercub with a lot of weight its performance suffers. I assume it has electrical system etc. If all the components are older that would really add up in a hurry. You could strip it out and it will help. My opinion is its a plane that does not need electrical systems to fulfill my mission.

 

[Bootlake]

Sorry about that. It is 980. Has full light weight elec and gel cell under the fron seat. Not sure what I could strip out to get the weight down. It has all metal interior. twin 18 gal tanks. Heavy duty gear and cabane, safety cables. Big PA-18 tail. VG's, Flaps. 8.50 tires. Speed fairings. And well maybe the wieght I was told was wrong. I cant imagine the plane haveing an extra 200 lbs worth of bolt ons!!

 

[pak]

From the original W&B you have a lot of add ons that could easily make up the weight difference. There is probably a difference in prop weights. On a SC the weight difference between a Borer prop and the stock Sensenich is a bunch. What tail wheel do you have? If it is a 3200 then it is quite a bit heavier than the original. The list goes on and on. The good news is you have a dandy plane and you will fly it regardless of what it weighs. Be aware of how easily you will go overgross and the difference in performance when it is empty and heavy. Have fun.

 

[Bootlake]

Thanks

Thanks for all the replies!! The advice is really appreciated!! I bought the darn thing and will be flying it by the end of the month! I am really excited! I never thought I would actually have a plane !!! I think it will be a good starter plane! Does anyone have a line on a good 0-290 d2 ??

 

[Taledrger]

Got an O-290-D2 on my SuperCub I might part with.....

 

[WSH]

Re: Thanks

.....Does anyone have a line on a good 0-290 d2 ??

Yes, I took one off my Super Cruiser around 5 years ago. It was running fine when I swapped it out for an 0320.

 

[RobS]

0290's on an 11 with flaps and a borer prop will be a real good performing machine. Heavier still, but a poor mans rocket. Fly the heck out of the engine you have now it'll be that much cheaper and fun.

 

[cork]

Price 0290 jugs and parts before you even think about it. That will make your mind up.