• If You Are Having Trouble Logging In with Your Old Username and Password, Please use this Forgot Your Password link to get re-established.
  • Hey! Be sure to login or register!

Tips for Keeping Passenger Warm...Without Roasting in the Front Seat?

WindOnHisNose

WindOnHisNose

BENEFACTOR
Lino Lakes MN (MY18)
I have the Atlee rear heat mod, and it works well but doesn't keep Julie warm enough in the back seat. Airleaks are dealt with using green Frog masking tape (no residue), but it really is uncomfortably cold back there sometimes. We are getting Santa's Super Cub ready for his annual flights, and I would like to make this better for her.

We have tried sleeping bags, but they are too bulky. Blankets are difficult to arrange around the passenger.

Ideas/tips?

Randy
 
Come back to Oklahoma and swipe Eaton’s extension/diffuser for the main heater outlet, it will keep your feet from roasting while sending more heat back to your favorite Elf.
 
Last edited:
I mentioned this before somewhere...install a curtain behind and under the rear seat floor to ceiling and side to side. Can be fabric compatible with the plane and tied in like a baggage covering. Cover the open area in the rear of the fuselage near the tail spring if it's been left uncovered. Put flexible fabric with a slit over the elevator trim slots in the fuselage. Cold comes from behind.

Also make sure any holes around the landing gear and boot cowl are covered. Install weather-strip around the door and upper window. Close any holes at the forward wing root fairing leading into the wing. Heat leaks out there from the rear of the cockpit.

Electric 12V vests and other garments for motorcycle or snowmachine riding are available and do work. https://www.revzilla.com/heated-motorcycle-gear

Gary
 
Last edited:
Heated seat

OLDCROWE said:
Come back to Oklahoma and swipe Eaton’s extension/diffuser for the main heater outlet, it will keep you from roasting while sending more heat back to your favorite Elf.
Click to expand...
I made a heated seat with control panel out of 2 gm heating elements and rear heat hose control box. Works good in my cub. Flown at -30f
 
I really like Milwaukee M12 heated jackets. Made for construction work the carbon fiber tech in it makes it work better than anything I have experienced. My wife wears it and I don't roast.
 
Kim is cold when it isn't cold, let alone when it is. Her trick is to put warmer packs in her boots and gloves. Never a problem once she does that. It's a cheaper/easier fix than revising your airplane.

If she's cold and you're roasting it should be simple enough to divert some of your hot air to the back. A temporary scat like in Glenn's picture works well if your heater-defroster box has an outlet for it.
 
cubdriver2 said:


Glenn
Click to expand...

This is a great solution, and very simple. There are many ways to collect the heat into the scat hose depending on what you have up front.

For heating the pilot, a small hole in the top of the scat will allow some warm air to escape and keep you warm.

A heated pair of pants and vest sold for motorcycle riding might be a quick and easy solution, also can be used for snowmachines, biking and lots of other uses.

Another solution would be to bring me the cub, get a PA-12 with a wide back seat, sit with her and keep her warm through body contact...:lol:

One positive of a heated suit would be her ability to control temperature to suit her.
 
My wife just received some Baffin extreme cold weather boots for her birthday, we have not flown in them yet but she said they are the warmest boots she has ever tried on. The hard part is proper dress for cold weather flying, means shedding layers if you go inside. If you are doing lots of stops and going inside, people tend not to dress warm enough. Smartwool base layer bottom and top Followed by warmest pants she can find. Layer the top, wool sweater, wool vest, with Down hooded coat and scarf. Mittens with hand/feet warmer. She can remove as needed at stops. My heat system is kind of different. Rear seat heat system is dedicated to defrost only. The normal front/defrost is fed to scat tube for rear seat. I am usually warm/hot if anything and I wear bunny boots in winter so feet are always warm. Having the extended scat tube shown above is nice because you can stick it in your jacket or to any cold spot.
DENNY
 
I got really cold on a winter trip to Yakima - I found that, once in, a piece of cardboard and a lambs wool fleece between my legs and the side panels/door worked wonders.

The back seat of a tandem can get deadly cold. A special heater plenum is the plan, but I would do the lambs wool trick back there too.

Here in SoCal we rarely even hook up the heaters. It is against the local code to fly with the door closed.
 
Randy,

If you haven’t already, block off the area just behind the aft stick, under the seat. Temporary, put a piece of solid fabric/Naugahyde, slide the top under the seat bottom cushion to keep in place, then tape the bottom and sides off to block off any air coming under the seat. You’d be surprised how much cold air flows forward from the tail, and enters the cockpit through that gap under the back seat.

MTV
 
The fix...have the pilot ride in the rear of a Cub on a brisk winter day. Note their attention to detail regarding frozen breath and which way it flows. Have them feel about for leaks and become quite motivated to fix same. Holding a hot cup of steaming tea in hand can show the cold flow too.

Also there's a serious note here. Carbon monoxide from exhaust is quite capable of entering the tail and moving forward with the cold air. Put a detector near the back seat and another visible from the front.

Gary
 
cubdriver2 said:


Glenn
Click to expand...
The backseaters that hang out with me would more than likely mistake that for a relief tube.....on purpose while taxing back to the hangar leaving you with the fresh scent of piss-potpourri shortly after the next start up
 
Lyn always used the engine cover as a blanket, it helped.

Keeping warm is a combination of stopping cold air from cycling in, and retaining the heat you have. One very important piece is to keep the head warm- may I suggest Sea Otter: Sea Fur Sewing in Sitka will fix her up.
 
mike mcs repair said:
make a VENT that will DRAW airflow to back seat.... sealing things up is not always useful...
Click to expand...
Mike you’re onto a good point, I had Pierce put snap vents in the D windows to help exhaust hot air in the summer which they do really well with both front vents and the boot cowl vent open but in the winter I still use them turned aft (open) with the heater on as necessary and the boot cowl vent open a tad they help pull warm air to the back.
 
WindOnHisNose said:
I have the Atlee rear heat mod, and it works well but doesn't keep Julie warm enough in the back seat. Airleaks are dealt with using green Frog masking tape (no residue), but it really is uncomfortably cold back there sometimes. We are getting Santa's Super Cub ready for his annual flights, and I would like to make this better for her.

We have tried sleeping bags, but they are too bulky. Blankets are difficult to arrange around the passenger.

Ideas/tips?

Randy
Click to expand...

Sell your pa-18 and buy a PA-12. You can hire a pilot to fly you around in the winter while you keep her warm....

Otherwise.... I have found the heated seat kits made for a car to work excellent.

Tim
 
OLDCROWE said:
Mike you’re onto a good point, I had Pierce put snap vents in the D windows to help exhaust hot air in the summer which they do really well with both front vents and the boot cowl vent open but in the winter I still use them turned aft (open) with the heater on as necessary and the boot cowl vent open a tad they help pull warm air to the back.
Click to expand...

When I flew two Airedales in my -18A they took to deep breathing in the cold. I finally put those snap vents in the rear windows to clear the dog breath and steam and it did help. They liked the idea plus sitting on the engine cover over a flat A-model floor.

Gary
 
OLDCROWE said:
Mike you’re onto a good point, I had Pierce put snap vents in the D windows to help exhaust hot air in the summer which they do really well with both front vents and the boot cowl vent open but in the winter I still use them turned aft (open) with the heater on as necessary and the boot cowl vent open a tad they help pull warm air to the back.
Click to expand...

It works in a Skywagon, too. Soros makes cabin air outlet vents to allow airflow. It works to allow cool or warm air into a small cabin. Kinda like opening an upstairs window to help the wood stove heat a cold cabin when you first get there. Airflow works. Crash used to tell guys to add a high vent in their engine covers to allow their combustion heaters to have airflow. Same same.

http://www.planeplastics.com/accessories/airflow-enhancement-kit
 
Last edited:
That can move heat (convective transfer), but it surely also discards some of the heat energy that was supplied by the source. The net heat gain in the enclosure is necessarily reduced.
 
You aren't baking a cake!

If there's no outflow you can't introduce inflow very well. It may not be intuitive but heat up a -30* cabin for 25 years or so and you learn a few tricks. Allowing the cold air to exit is one of them.
 
Allowing the cold air to exit is one of them.
Click to expand...
That permits some quick transport of heat to upstairs in a cold-soaked building, but steady-state, the net heat flow into the enclosure is reduced and the downstairs is colder.

Sorry Stewart, but no neophyte here. I heated my leaky old two-story home exclusively with wood for quite a few years. 20+ cords per year. Once I got the infiltration reduced in the rehab process, I used a LOT less wood. Like half. And it was a LOT more comfortable as well, both upstairs and down.
 
Nope. Heat in minus heat out equals heat gained. Now, in a drafty Cub cabin, I agree that doesn't really apply. There, it becomes a matter of directing the heat in toward specifically where it's most wanted, cuz it ain't gonna accumulate! :smile:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

WindOnHisNose
A Vetterman Application to Prevent "Tail Pumping"...and Keep Rear Passenger Warmer
2
Replies
41
Views
8K
Utah 12 Driver
U
S
Barnstorm 2021: A Supercub Flying Adventure Across America
Replies
1
Views
1K
mam90
M
AlaskaAV
(moved) Early Wien Air Alaska Stories
Replies
0
Views
2K
AlaskaAV
AlaskaAV
Patrol Guy
THE LAST FLIGHT
Replies
13
Views
5K
Gunny
Gunny
Patrol Guy
THE LAST FLIGHT
Replies
0
Views
759
Patrol Guy
Patrol Guy
Back
Top