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Thread: Mini, portable efis?

  1. #41
    aktango58's Avatar
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    Just looking it up, from Garmin stuff:

    $2,500 gets you the stuff to plug and go. Yes, it does the turn coordinator. Yes, STC'd. Yes, other units might do more. (The Dynon is STC'd by the EAA in cubs fyi).



    G5 Electronic Flight Instrument for Certificated Aircraft

    Primary Attitude Indicator

    PART NUMBER: K10-00280-00


    $2,149.00USD




    • DG/HSI
    • Replaces traditional electromechanical instruments; can be configured in attitude, DG/HI/HSI and turn coordinator positions







    • Bright, sunlight-readable 3.5” LCD color display, sized to fit standard 3-1/8” instrument cutout
    • Certified via approved model list (AML) for STC’d installation on more than 560 aircraft makes and models
    • Includes a 4-hour backup battery with battery status indicator
    • Dual G5 installation offers reversionary display capability plus the added redundancy of dual ADAHRS and dual backup batteries



    HOW COOL IS IT THAT LESS THAN 10 YEARS AGO WE NEVER CONSIDERED HAVING AN EFIS AVAILABLE FOR OUR CUBS!!!!!!!!





    I don't know where you've been me lad, but I see you won first Prize!

  2. #42
    hotrod180's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hotrod180 View Post
    Besides the harness connector, the install kit includes a mounting bracket which attaches to a standard 3-1/8" hole and accepts the G5.
    Looks to me like it would be more than $50 worth of PITA to fabricate a substitute.
    Like Eddie747, I thought it was BS for Garmin to sell the install kit separately but I suppose there's some sort of reasoning behind it.
    It came to me that maybe it's so a person could buy two installation kits and one G5, then easily swap the G5 from one airplane to another in about 3 minutes. Duh.
    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!

  3. #43
    hotrod180's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimParker256 View Post
    You absolutely can install a G5 in your plane without going through any FAA approval process (other than the IA sign-off). The issue is that you don't want to pay for the version of the G5 that comes with the STC / Approval already done for you.....Yeah, I wish we could use the cheaper experimental version.....
    IMHO you can install the non-STC'd version. I did, as a minor installation per FAA policy statement PS-ACE-23-08. Read it and decide for yourself if you can do the same thing.

    https://www.faasafety.gov/spans/noti....aspx?nid=6203
    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!

  4. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by hotrod180 View Post
    IMHO you can install the non-STC'd version. I did, as a minor installation per FAA policy statement PS-ACE-23-08. Read it and decide for yourself if you can do the same thing.

    https://www.faasafety.gov/spans/noti....aspx?nid=6203

    Thanks, running it by my A/P tomorrow.
    Last edited by Eddie747; 04-16-2017 at 11:43 AM.

  5. #45
    hotrod180's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FdxLou View Post
    Keep in mind that the Mini GA has a built in gps with a map page and updatable nav database.
    It also has synvis and terrain/obstacles. No comparison between the two imho.
    I believe that Avmap alsp sells a similar instrusment, with GPS & aviation database. Its in the Spruce catalog but not in the same section as the other EFIS stuff.
    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!
    Likes FdxLou liked this post

  6. #46
    CubCruiser's Avatar
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    Over the past couple of weeks I've had the opportunity to fly the G5 in the new Super Legend HP factory demo plane.

    After 30 hours of flying and putting a lot of folks in the front seat for demo flights at Sun'n Fun, I can say that I really like the functionality and layout of the unit and it was an easy transition for those who've only flown steam gauges. The airspeed does blank out at 20mph during departure stalls though

    Daryl
    Daryl Hickman, CFI
    N87DH American Super Legend HP
    N4987H Piper PA-11S Cub Special

  7. #47
    CubCruiser's Avatar
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    Click image for larger version. 

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    Daryl Hickman, CFI
    N87DH American Super Legend HP
    N4987H Piper PA-11S Cub Special

  8. #48

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    I like the display of the Garmin G5 a lot, leaning towards the GRT GA because of the database and nav capabilities, I dont have anything to hook the G5 to to navigate with. The GRT display looks cartoonish in all the pictures I have found, are the screenshots on GRT page what it actually looks like?

    Disregard, found a good pic of one, those must be drawings on the website making it look cartoonish.Looks diff from the Garmin but I like it, lot more features, worth the extra $400 and dont have to buy the install kit extra LOL. I even think it is MIA, wonder if Garmin is?

    Last edited by Eddie747; 04-16-2017 at 11:19 PM.

  9. #49

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    MIA? Missing In Action?
    Jim Parker
    '65 Champion 7ECA - Flying
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  10. #50

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    Quote Originally Posted by JimParker256 View Post
    MIA? Missing In Action?
    They put them together at this little shop in the U.S.A.
    Thanks JimParker256 thanked for this post
    Likes JimParker256, barbwire liked this post

  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by stewartb View Post
    Eddie, since you asked. http://www.mypilotstore.com/MyPilotS...FUGTfgodHIIOiw

    The GDL39-3D communicates with Garmin Pilot and Foreflight. GP includes synthetic vision in the subscription. Foreflight adds a premium for syn vis. My subscription costs $75 per year and on my iDevices it updates automatically when updates are released. There are some features that don't work as well on Androids (you need to ask an Android user) but unlike Foreflight, it is supported for Androids. It also can link to some of Garmin's aviation GPS units giving them ADHRS functions, so if you use a GPS you can get your HSI or AH from that. Not trying to convince you or sway you, just answering your questions. I'm still interested why guys favor the other options mentioned previously.
    I've been using a GDL 39 3D bluetoothed to a 796 and in 3D vision I find it is quite jumpy in pitch. Has anyone one else noticed this? The antenna needs to be as vertical as possible to help this but it is still too sensitive to be of real value.

    I had a Dynon D1 and it was much more useful.
    Nicht der Ort fur mich.

  12. #52

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    Researching these and found these quotes, they point to this thing called Stratux and a free app called Avare, I use Avare it's great and free, but I have never used Stratux but apparently works better than GDL

    "Garmin didn't support me! It is sitting on a shelf behind me and a Stratux is running in the cockpit feeding Avare. Problem solved."


    "I've owned many Garmins and currently every one of my vehicles has a Garmin GPS but they are very proprietary, and the GDL39 only works with their toys.


    The Stratux costs way less and works with almost every app out there."


    "Stratux that gives you ADS-B IN plus AHRS for less than $200 and will work with AVARE"

  13. #53

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    My understanding is the antenna on the GDLs is for ADS-B while the GPS antenna is internal. My antenna is usually laid back nearly horizontal and it works perfectly.

    To the question, no, my iPad/iPhone/Garmin Pilot app have not been jumpy at all. Like I said earlier the HSI mimics my DG quite closely. My synthetic vision and AH screen are very accurate depictions of the view out front and my panel AH. I'm impressed every time I use it. I look forward to running the G3X though the paces next to the iPad and will use one of my cams to record it so I can compare them carefully. Initially I'll use the iPad as the reference to validate the G3X because it's a known entity.

    These devices change fast, so take internet comments with that in mind. The Garmin GDL39-3D supports Garmin Pilot and Foreflight for ADHRS capability. It has for about a year.

  14. #54
    spinner2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stewartb View Post
    My understanding is the antenna on the GDLs is for ADS-B while the GPS antenna is internal. My antenna is usually laid back nearly horizontal and it works perfectly.

    To the question, no, my iPad/iPhone/Garmin Pilot app have not been jumpy at all.
    That is good to hear. Maybe the 796 doesn't handle the data as well? In playing with mine though the jumpiness gets much worse with the adjustable antenna laid flat. Pitch and roll needs to be reset every 10-15 minutes.
    Nicht der Ort fur mich.

  15. #55

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    I don't have a clue how these magic boxes work but your description centers on ADHRS. Is that a function of the GPS? I thought it's an added sensor in the 3D model. Maybe a call to Garmin would be worthwhile. You've made a multiple Garmin equipment purchase. It's reasonable to expect it to work.

  16. #56

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    Quote Originally Posted by spinner2 View Post
    That is good to hear. Maybe the 796 doesn't handle the data as well? In playing with mine though the jumpiness gets much worse with the adjustable antenna laid flat. Pitch and roll needs to be reset every 10-15 minutes.
    I can no longer get Wx data to display from the GDL (sure glad I kept XM) on my 796 although the traffic works great. Called Garmin and not much help, suggested updating the firmware on the 796 and maybe on the GDL... I also have found that the ADHERS function on the 796 works better with the Garmin finger fully extended.
    "Don't feed the hipsters"

  17. #57
    hotrod180's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eddie747 View Post

    How large is that instrument?
    If it's about the same as my Garmin G5, there's just way too much information displayed in a small space to suit me.
    It is impressive how much is there, but I'd want the screen to be at least 5 x 5 or maybe even larger to avoid clutter.
    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!

  18. #58

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    GDLs require occasional updates. If you don't have the GDL 39 Utility app on your phone you need to get it. It's easier for us who bluetooth to iDevices but may be easily overlooked for 796 users (my iPhone and iPad are set to auto update when Garmin releases. I have to look at my GDL utility app to see if the GDL needs updating). In my Garmin experience problems are usually software related and the fault has been mine for not keeping them up to date.
    Last edited by stewartb; 04-17-2017 at 12:51 PM. Reason: sp

  19. #59

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    Quote Originally Posted by stewartb View Post
    GDLs require occasional updates. If you don't have the GDL 39 Utility app on your phone you need to get it. It's easier for us who bluetooth to iDevices but may be easily overlooked for 796 users (my iPhone and iPad are set to auto update when Garmin releases. I have to look at my GDL utility app to see if the GDL needs updating). In my Garmin experience problems are usually software related and the fault has been mine for not keeping them up to date.
    Thanks Stewart, I'll try that.
    "Don't feed the hipsters"

  20. #60

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eddie747 View Post
    Stratux that gives you ADS-B IN plus AHRS for less than $200 and will work with AVARE
    According to the current "Stratux Status" page, AHRS is "In Development" but the work is not yet completed, so not available quite yet. Other than that, a Stratux device is an incredible bargain, and works with a myriad of EFBs, both iOS and Android. Good stuff!
    Jim Parker
    '65 Champion 7ECA - Flying
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  21. #61
    txpacer's Avatar
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    The FlightBox​ version of Stratux has an AHRS module that is supposed to work well. I have not yet upgraded mine, but I probably will someday.

    I have an Avmap Ultra mini EFIS in the T-18. I like the presentation better than the Garmin, less cluttered. It has a built-in magnetometer, GPS with database and HSI mode. The G5 seems like it's primarily intended to interface with other Garmin products.

  22. #62
    spinner2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stewartb View Post
    GDLs require occasional updates. If you don't have the GDL 39 Utility app on your phone you need to get it. It's easier for us who bluetooth to iDevices but may be easily overlooked for 796 users (my iPhone and iPad are set to auto update when Garmin releases. I have to look at my GDL utility app to see if the GDL needs updating). In my Garmin experience problems are usually software related and the fault has been mine for not keeping them up to date.
    I think that is true only of you're using the GDL 39 with an IOS device. The quoted paragraph below is from Garmin's Support Center and indicates that the portable device, in my case the 796, will update the GDL. This is the same way the firmware for the XM antenna is updated.

    "If you are using the GDL 39 along with a Garmin aviation portable device the software will be received through the portable device. The software for your portable can be obtained by either visiting myGarmin.com or using our WebUpdater program. If you are using the GDL 39 along with an iOS or Android moible device you can use the Garmin Pilot application."

    I emailed Garmin a few questions about the jumpy attitude problem.
    Nicht der Ort fur mich.
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  23. #63

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    Well, the FlightBox web page states that the AHRS boards are "back-ordered"... The description further down states "Work on AHRS is already under way and should be available soon," which is almost word for word what the Stratux development web site says. I wonder if the AHRS boards will mysteriously become available about the time that the Stratux team finishes the development work on the AHRS module? Otherwise, I'm at a loss to understand how FlightBox (which is 100% Stratux under the covers) has features that the software does not yet have implemented...
    Jim Parker
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  24. #64

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    Quote Originally Posted by JimParker256 View Post
    According to the current "Stratux Status" page, AHRS is "In Development" but the work is not yet completed, so not available quite yet. Other than that, a Stratux device is an incredible bargain, and works with a myriad of EFBs, both iOS and Android. Good stuff!
    I dont use it but if you google it you will find people that are. It says the AHRS is in development but I'm sure if you read up and send some emails you'll get more info on how to get it.
    Last edited by Eddie747; 04-18-2017 at 08:16 AM.

  25. #65
    txpacer's Avatar
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    FlightBox shipped out their first batch of AHRS modules in January. Haven't heard any reports on how they're working.

  26. #66

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    Cool. I've been watching the Stratux web site for news that AHRS support was ready. Good to know it's getting closer. Not sure why I care so much, since I already have a Stratus 2. Probably because I'm a tinkerer at heart, and like the idea of an "I built it myself" solution.
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  27. #67
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    Got a Husky to fly for a couple weeks. Just had G5 and G660 installed. New radio and adsb transponder to.

    Click image for larger version. 

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  28. #68

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eddie747 View Post
    I like the display of the Garmin G5 a lot, leaning towards the GRT GA because of the database and nav capabilities, I dont have anything to hook the G5 to to navigate with. The GRT display looks cartoonish in all the pictures I have found, are the screenshots on GRT page what it actually looks like?

    Disregard, found a good pic of one, those must be drawings on the website making it look cartoonish.Looks diff from the Garmin but I like it, lot more features, worth the extra $295. and dont have to buy the install kit extra LOL. I even think it is MIA, made in America, wonder if Garmin is?


    Quote Originally Posted by hotrod180 View Post
    How large is that instrument?
    If it's about the same as my Garmin G5, there's just way too much information displayed in a small space to suit me.
    It is impressive how much is there, but I'd want the screen to be at least 5 x 5 or maybe even larger to avoid clutter.
    That screen is a larger 6" screen from another GRT unit, just showing what actual display looks like. I couldnt find any real pictures of the GRT mini, just cartoon looking drawings on there website or not good quality distorted pictures. Here is a picture of the GRT GA mini efis installed on top of the Dynon D1 pocket EFIS, the D1 is roughly or slightly larger than the Garmin G5, that G5 is nice but I am interested in the GRT mini now after seeing it in action, watched several youtube vids, it does a lot more than the G5. Its bigger 4.3" wide x 3.9" tall with a 4.3 inch display, and will still fit nice where my altimeter is, which will move down a hole where my VSI currently is after it is removed.

    The Garmin G5 is $1400 with install kit and internal battery, and needs to be permanently installed, the GRT GA mini is $1695., $295 more but is not permanently mounted it has a mount it is secured to and electrical quick release electrical connection or cig outlet plug to power it so you can take it out quick and easily and use it in a different aircraft if needed, and has an internal battery already installed that you dont have to pay an extra $150. for. Also has its own gps database to nav with and flight director to engage and display using its own nav database, the Garmin must be connected to a separate gps navigation unit to do that. The GRT mini seems like the better choice with so many more features including synthetic vision and moving map display page.

    Last edited by Eddie747; 04-20-2017 at 02:14 PM.

  29. #69
    hotrod180's Avatar
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    Add the bottom row(s) of information from the larger screened unit on to the smaller GA Mini, and it doesn't seem like there'd be much room left for the artificial horizon / synthetic vision display. Like I said, that GA Mini's capabilities are impressive, but IMHO just too much information for that small screen. I think I'd prefer the larger screened one if it was me.
    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!

  30. #70

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    I dont think thats possible to add the engine moniter on the mini efis, that pic is of one of the full efis units here www.grtavionics.com/efissystems.html

    I posted that pic just to show the nice resolution of the mini, should be about the same as the bigger unit.
    Last edited by Eddie747; 04-20-2017 at 12:43 PM.

  31. #71

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    Quote Originally Posted by kase View Post
    Got a Husky to fly for a couple weeks. Just had G5 and G660 installed. New radio and adsb transponder to.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Why is your tach marked red from 2000 - 2250?

  32. #72
    skywagon8a's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eddie747 View Post
    Why is your tach marked red from 2000 - 2250?
    From the type certificate:
    Hartzell HC-C2YK-1BF/F7666A (Constant Speed)Diameter not over 76 in., not under 72 in.Pitch setting at 30 in. stationlow 11.7° ± .2°, high 29.0° ± 1.0Takeoff & maximum continuous power 2700 RPMPlacard required: "AVOID CONTINUOUS OPERATIONS BETWEEN2000-2250 RPM"
    N1PA
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  33. #73

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    Yeah, I REALLY wish the folks at GRT would re-do their web site, and show "full-resolution" screen shots of the actual products, instead of just a "representation" of what they look like. On the web site, their engine instruments (when displayed in smaller form on the PFD screen) are basically useless. The resolution is so poor and the bar graphs so compressed that you couldn't tell if your CHT was rising or falling without going full-screen.

    So I was already kind of "turned off" by the web pictures, and by the time I got to their OSH booth last year (coming directly over from the Dynon / AFS booth) I was still pretty disappointed in the poor resolution and lack of clarity of their smaller screens, but will admit the larger screens look better "in person" than they do in the pictures on their web site - by a long shot. They are really doing themselves a HUGE disservice with those awful "screen shots" from previous-generation products.
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  34. #74
    nanook's Avatar
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    The larger GRT has a 'G' meter on it?

  35. #75

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    This is out of the GRT manual, it's 4.3 inch screen, the case outer dimensions are 4.35" wide by 3.95" high, still lots of info displayed on a small screen, but having a nav database built in means not having to bring the iPad or tablet, kiss principle. For just $295 more than the Garmin G5 you get a lot more capable unit, I do like the clean look of the G5 it looks easier to fly with, like the Collins pro line I fly, but I like having the moving map and navigation plus synthetic vision all in one unit for the cub sounds like my best choice. Still considering all options but will probably get this one next month.. wonder if GRT will be at Oshkosh and offer a discounted price.. not that $1695. is a bad deal espesially if the AHRS is as good as the Garmin AHRS.. anyone know about the quality of AHRS in these little gems.. I have no idea what they are made of. Are they all the same?


  36. #76
    hotrod180's Avatar
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    Looks pretty sweet.
    I use my tablet with the Avare GPS app for navigating.
    I like having the tablet along because I can use it to check wx, look at airport diagrams, etc.
    Plus use it to check email (and surf supercub.org!) via wifi once I reach my destination.
    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!

  37. #77

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    I would definitely look for "show specials" during OSH. During Sun-N-Fun, they were offering this special: http://www.grtavionics.com/2017_Sun-n-Fun_Specials.pdf (Note the limitations on "Order placed by" and "Order paid by" dates.

    They will probably do something similar for AirVenture.

    PS - rumor from another forum that Garmin may have their G5 STC'ed for autopilot around OSH timeframe. Since Garmin is usually very tight-lipped about future product announcements, that rumor is probably worth every bit of the $0.00 you paid for it...
    Jim Parker
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