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Thread: Working CarbonCub

  1. #41
    RaisedByWolves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joseph206 View Post
    Nice
    Yeah Joe doesn't use his cub to get in and out of short places or fly on days others wouldn't dare open there hangar door.


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  2. #42
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    I recall a discussion some years back after the CC won Valdez with a well known pilot (PC) at the helm. That pilot, an owner of many planes, posted that they loaded the CC up with a 'normal' cub load one time.

    The lower longerons showed sag with the load he said, and he had a few other comments that were describing the CC as a great plane, but not built for the abuse put to cubs up here working.

    I did look that same CC over, and I was not impressed with the light weight attach points for the ailerons or the flimsy panels inside. I have offered many times for CC owners to join me for a week moose hunt, tossing in camp gear and moose quarters-sharp bones and all- but no takers.

    Trust me, there is a difference between landing in a 200' field, and working of a 500' field of softball size and larger rock hauling 200 lb bags of meat and bone, plastic boxes with sharp corners, dirty rafts and people. Just loading and unloading causes it's own share of abuse.

    Not that the CC won't land everywhere and do most, but for longevity bigger stronger is better. Might not be as fun, but it all has tradeoffs.
    I don't know where you've been me lad, but I see you won first Prize!
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  3. #43
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    First off, I am not a cub type owner but have been looking at them for many years. I have been looking at the CC and Legend since they were introduced. I always felt the CC in particular was built to the lightest possible materials whereas I felt the Legend might be built slightly heavier constructed. Not many Legend guys on this site but I am curious if anyone has an opinion as to whether or not this is correct.
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  4. #44
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    The Legend is built right off the Piper blue prints except a little wider and the left hand door.
    Steve Pierce

    Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects.
    Will Rogers
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  5. #45

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    Quote Originally Posted by WWhunter View Post
    First off, I am not a cub type owner but have been looking at them for many years. I have been looking at the CC and Legend since they were introduced. I always felt the CC in particular was built to the lightest possible materials whereas I felt the Legend might be built slightly heavier constructed. Not many Legend guys on this site but I am curious if anyone has an opinion as to whether or not this is correct.
    Having flown a new Legend with the Titan 180 HP for a few hours, I can easily say that it's a very nice plane to fly and a seriously good performer. What I can't tell you personally, is how closely the Legend compares to an original PA-18-150 HP construction wise, however, it is supposed to be a virtual copy.
    The Legend's fusalage is 3" wider, it has some carbon fibre in places, it's gross wt is 1750 lbs. and for all intents and purposes, it looks exactly like the original; struts are the same and the bare fuselage looks the same for example. We've heard more then once that the Legend 180 will out perform the CC in everything except top speed. (CC has a shorter wing verses the Legend's 35' plus some).
    Please note that I have no way to verify, in fact you'd need the two performing at the same show to get any idea on this matter of performance. A trip to Sun N Fun would shed some light on which of the two aircraft most closely resembles the original Super Cub. (if indeed the ultimate end result is to be as close to the original so that you've got something tough enough to haul moose quarters, old greasy Elans, sled dogs, busted outboards, diving equipment, cannons, squalling grandkids, trout and dead bears).
    I like the post that says he "works" his CC by hauling around his lunch and the crew's paycheques, or words to that effect. Has this thread descended into "no guts no glory"? Who is going to put a partially butchered big ol moose in a Carbon Cub?
    Roddy
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  6. #46
    CubCruiser's Avatar
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    I now have a little over a hundred hours of student instruction in my Super Legend HP. Lots of landings on back country strips in the Cascades as well as some off-airport landings. Took it through its first 100 hour/Annual in February and no maintenance issues so far.

    There re are a number of conveniences over my 150hp 18A:
    The wider cockpit is nice since I spend most of my time in the backseat;
    I like having a carb heat control back there as well;
    The second door is nice, especially on those (rare) hot days in the Pacific Northwest;
    And it climbs like the proverbial scalded dog runs.

    All the students who've flown it, love it.

    Daryl
    Daryl Hickman, CFI
    N87DH American Super Legend HP
    N4987H Piper PA-11S Cub Special
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  7. #47
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    Y'all do realize the CC was designed and certified as a LSA aircraft right? 1320lbGW versus what, the lightest of the SC's at 1,750lb gw and going up to 2300lb gw.

    Just saying not really an Apple to Apple comparison when we are talking about loading up a working airplane to GW's Was never designed to be a working Cub at 1,750-2,300lbs
    Mike Sasser/Boomerang Air
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  8. #48

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    Quote Originally Posted by wireweinie View Post
    Wow! A headliner!

    Web
    That's my ol cub...1951. Rock solid and rough....
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  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by ATXCubDriver View Post
    Y'all do realize the CC was designed and certified as a LSA aircraft right? 1320lbGW versus what, the lightest of the SC's at 1,750lb gw and going up to 2300lb gw.

    Just saying not really an Apple to Apple comparison when we are talking about loading up a working airplane to GW's Was never designed to be a working Cub at 1,750-2,300lbs
    Some SC are 1500 GW and some CC are at 1800? GW depending on how they are certified but I think all CC are almost the same plane at either weight?

    Glenn
    "Optimism is going after Moby Dick in a rowboat and taking the tartar sauce with you!"

  10. #50

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    The EX kit can be penciled in at 1800+ or 1320 according to owners preference. With two growing boys in the seats you can't put in much fuel at 1320, but its strictly a legal consideration. Same plane. I think the factory built can be delivered with either number on the certificate.
    What's a go-around?
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  11. #51

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    You can't buy an EX version that's factory built unless you participate in the building of the parts and components. The 51% rule is in effect.
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  12. #52

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    My aircraft partner and I are close to ordering an EX2 kit. He wants it at 1320, but it just occured to me that if you always park it with full fuel, its a single seat aircraft. damn
    What's a go-around?
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  13. #53

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    Well, whatever the factory Carbon is called.

    Quote Originally Posted by stewartb View Post
    You can't buy an EX version that's factory built unless you participate in the building of the parts and components. The 51% rule is in effect.
    What's a go-around?

  14. #54

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    The factory built version is S-LSA. An owner can move/reclassify that version into the E-LSA class for maintenance reasons but never to a higher gross than 1320. The EX is a E-AB airplane. Different rules apply.

    I'm surprised anyone would go with the 1320# gross now that 3rd class medical reform is here.
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  15. #55
    ATXCubDriver's Avatar
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    EX-2 is a different animal than the SS. Different wall thickness on tubing in several areas. Totally different tail feathers. Heavier gear. G Series Wing.

    To my knowledge no Carbon Cub SS has left the factory at anything other than 1320lb GW unless it was on floats. The original EX kit is different than the current EX-2 kit. This is why I said lets stick to apples to apples when comparing.

    Top Cub to SuperCub would be an apples to apples comparison. I know the OP wasn't asking that question but this thread drifted away from that quickly.

    Anyone know how Piper tested the SC wing for strength? I keep hearing comments about strength just curious how that strength number is being derived.
    Last edited by ATXCubDriver; 03-14-2017 at 08:46 AM.
    Mike Sasser/Boomerang Air
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  16. #56
    ATXCubDriver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stewartb View Post
    You can't buy an EX version that's factory built unless you participate in the building of the parts and components. The 51% rule is in effect.

    The Carbon Cub FX that you will find on the website is a Factory Assist program that takes the EX-2 kit and builds it at the factory. Totally different bird than the Carbon Cub SS as stated in my other post.
    Mike Sasser/Boomerang Air
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  17. #57
    ATXCubDriver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skywalker View Post
    My aircraft partner and I are close to ordering an EX2 kit. He wants it at 1320, but it just occured to me that if you always park it with full fuel, its a single seat aircraft. damn

    What is his reasoning for wanting to do it at 1,320lbs?
    Mike Sasser/Boomerang Air
    mike@boomerangair.net

    OK,AR,TX,LA

  18. #58
    mvivion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ATXCubDriver View Post
    EX-2 is a different animal than the SS. Different wall thickness on tubing in several areas. Totally different tail feathers. Heavier gear. G Series Wing.

    To my knowledge no Carbon Cub SS has left the factory at anything other than 1320lb GW unless it was on floats. The original EX kit is different than the current EX-2 kit. This is why I said lets stick apples to apples when comparing.

    Top Cub to SuperCub would be an apples to apples comparison. I know the OP wasn't asking that question but this thread drifted away from that quickly.

    Anyone know how Piper tested the SC wing for strength? I keep hearing comments about strength just curious how that strength number is being derived.
    That is true, but representatives of the company have regularly stated that, even thought the LS version is set at 1320, the "design" has been tested at over 1800. That "implies" that: a. The LS version is identical to the EX version, and b. It's probably okay to operate them all at the higher weight.

    MTV
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  19. #59

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    He saw my copy of the new ACS and is not sure he'll ever go Private. We're just backwoods types, no cross country, no ATC. Basic Med spurred me to get my medical back last year so I'm lobbying for 1865.

    Quote Originally Posted by ATXCubDriver View Post
    What is his reasoning for wanting to do it at 1,320lbs?
    What's a go-around?
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  20. #60

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    During the two years I waffled over which kit to buy the CC reps I spoke with made it clear that the EX kit built light and certified at 1320 would not be as light as the factory S-LSA because the EX kit was stronger. Since I never figured to respect the 1320# limit I saw that as an advantage. The factory S-LSA airplanes are probably fine for "working" under the 1320# limit. From what I've seen the EX airplanes are holding up at the 1835# limit as well. A properly built EX is a very nice airplane.
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  21. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roddy View Post
    Having flown a new Legend with the Titan 180 HP for a few hours, I can easily say that it's a very nice plane to fly and a seriously good performer. What I can't tell you personally, is how closely the Legend compares to an original PA-18-150 HP construction wise, however, it is supposed to be a virtual copy.
    The Legend's fusalage is 3" wider, it has some carbon fibre in places, it's gross wt is 1750 lbs. and for all intents and purposes, it looks exactly like the original; struts are the same and the bare fuselage looks the same for example. We've heard more then once that the Legend 180 will out perform the CC in everything except top speed. (CC has a shorter wing verses the Legend's 35' plus some).
    Please note that I have no way to verify, in fact you'd need the two performing at the same show to get any idea on this matter of performance. A trip to Sun N Fun would shed some light on which of the two aircraft most closely resembles the original Super Cub. (if indeed the ultimate end result is to be as close to the original so that you've got something tough enough to haul moose quarters, old greasy Elans, sled dogs, busted outboards, diving equipment, cannons, squalling grandkids, trout and dead bears).
    I like the post that says he "works" his CC by hauling around his lunch and the crew's paycheques, or words to that effect. Has this thread descended into "no guts no glory"? Who is going to put a partially butchered big ol moose in a Carbon Cub?
    Roddy
    Roddy
    Thanks you helped me see I have answered my own question. I don't have a CC yet, it's a sport cub and I use it for my work in our production season. Nope, I haven't put a cut up bear or a moose in back, but did take the seat out last fall and flew a turbocharger after cooler to a broken farm tractor, landed in the field and helped my guys fix it

    before that I threw a new combine belt out the window that I flew 2 hours north to get so they could get it back moving same day

    also threw a hyd hose out the window to get a sprayer moving again the next week

    Dropped off a Frito Lay exec who was in town looking at potatoes at the big airport Dropped him right beside the company Challenger jet that was taking him back to Dallas he said he felt like a rock star

    And yes, lunch and pay checks. I enjoy the cub much more than my pickup
    My name is Jim and my CubCrafters works. Sometimes
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  22. #62
    Farmboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scouter View Post
    Roddy
    Thanks you helped me see I have answered my own question.
    - turbocharger after cooler to a broken farm tractor, landed in the field and helped my guys fix it
    - new combine belt - moving same day
    - hyd hose - moving again
    - Dropped off a Frito Lay exec - right beside the company Challenger jet that was taking him back to Dallas he said he felt like a rock star

    My name is Jim and my CubCrafters works. Sometimes
    The best pickup truck money can buy.

    Jim, back when he was farming my dad used to fly his Lark Commander in much the same way. When time was short there was no better option to get the job done.
    I had somewhat forgotten about the impression if can leave on people, but I'm sure you haven't. That Frito Lay exec enjoyed his rock star status, and won't forget it.
    There's an article in this months sport aviation magazine about an ex-feed producer who discovered if he could get potential customers to his farm, he could close 90% of them versus a normal 50% close ratio. His airplane made that happen.


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  23. #63
    cubdriver2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scouter View Post
    Roddy
    Thanks you helped me see I have answered my own question. I don't have a CC yet, it's a sport cub and I use it for my work in our production season. Nope, I haven't put a cut up bear or a moose in back, but did take the seat out last fall and flew a turbocharger after cooler to a broken farm tractor, landed in the field and helped my guys fix it

    before that I threw a new combine belt out the window that I flew 2 hours north to get so they could get it back moving same day

    also threw a hyd hose out the window to get a sprayer moving again the next week

    Dropped off a Frito Lay exec who was in town looking at potatoes at the big airport Dropped him right beside the company Challenger jet that was taking him back to Dallas he said he felt like a rock star

    And yes, lunch and pay checks. I enjoy the cub much more than my pickup
    My name is Jim and my CubCrafters works. Sometimes
    Hey at least the window didn't fall off of this one............................................... .................................................. ....................................yet

    Glenn
    "Optimism is going after Moby Dick in a rowboat and taking the tartar sauce with you!"

  24. #64
    Scouter's Avatar
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    That's why I hang around Larry "Birddog" Grenier

  25. #65
    Dave Calkins's Avatar
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    Drift Alarm!!!

    ........whats the aftermarket shock of choice for the Carbon Cub?

    3x3 gear?

    for 35"'s?

    this isnt a smart ass question. I have friends looking to spend bucks on their Carbon Cubs and they dont know and I dont know. And I dont know if the planes are tough enough. Maybe they are.

    thanks. Maybe I will begin a new thread to get the question out. D
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  26. #66

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    Quote Originally Posted by aktango58 View Post
    I have offered many times for CC owners to join me for a week moose hunt, tossing in camp gear and moose quarters-sharp bones and all- but no takers.
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  27. #67
    Joseph206's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Delamarter View Post
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    Wish I was closer, I would be right along side of you !!!!
    Unfortunately I still have to work for a living and can't take that much time, Just yet.
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  28. #68

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joseph206 View Post
    Wish I was closer, I would be right along side of you !!!!
    Unfortunately I still have to work for a living and can't take that much time, Just yet.
    Joseph206, unfortunately, this pic isn't of me. It's Toby Ashley, one of our kit guys. He uses his Carbon Cub like a "real airplane", as you can see. He's not the only one. We have several customers that very quietly use them hard in the back country.


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  29. #69
    RaisedByWolves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Delamarter View Post
    Joseph206, unfortunately, this pic isn't of me. It's Toby Ashley, one of our kit guys. He uses his Carbon Cub like a "real airplane", as you can see. He's not the only one. We have several customers that very quietly use them hard in the back country.


    Sent from my iPhone using SuperCub.Org mobile app
    I know a guy like that too, he's not a keyboard warrior, he is out when everyone else is too scared to open there hangar door.
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  30. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Delamarter View Post
    Joseph206, unfortunately, this pic isn't of me. It's Toby Ashley, one of our kit guys. He uses his Carbon Cub like a "real airplane", as you can see. He's not the only one. We have several customers that very quietly use them hard in the back country


    Sent from my iPhone using SuperCub.Org mobile app
    Jon

    Anymore pix of that CC in your post? Looks like a hoss

    jim
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  31. #71
    Farmboy's Avatar
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    Wasn't that the 81 day build? Surprisingly hard to find photos.

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  32. #72
    Eddie Foy's Avatar
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    Who makes the carbon fiber belly pod?
    Eddie Foy
    "Put out my hand and touched the face of God"

  33. #73
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  34. #74
    ATXCubDriver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Farmboy View Post

    Correct. Randy Apling at Carbon Concepts in Alaska.
    Last edited by ATXCubDriver; 03-17-2017 at 10:00 PM.
    Mike Sasser/Boomerang Air
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  35. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Calkins View Post
    Drift Alarm!!!

    ........whats the aftermarket shock of choice for the Carbon Cub?

    3x3 gear?

    for 35"'s?

    this isnt a smart ass question. I have friends looking to spend bucks on their Carbon Cubs and they dont know and I dont know. And I dont know if the planes are tough enough. Maybe they are.

    thanks. Maybe I will begin a new thread to get the question out. D

    anyone? Thanks.

  36. #76
    Aktahoe Aktahoe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Calkins View Post
    anyone? Thanks.
    TK 1 Monster Shocks no question Dave.

    The Flying Cowboys in Utah are working there CC's hard! All with TKs. I too am anxious to see how they are holding up here in a few months...

    AKT
    www.bigtirepilot.com
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  37. #77

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    Quote Originally Posted by Farmboy View Post
    Not to pick on Mark's comment, but so much of this is entirely subjective to the perspective of the viewer.
    In the northeast I just don't see "working supercubs"
    Few operators I know around here fly turbines, rarely you can see a radial Ag-Cat/Thrush.I suspect cub covers less ground per day and dusting is time sensitive. There are hard working cubs in the NE though:banner towing at low level, hot, every day, long hours etc...Some fly out of paved fields some from grass. They range from standard 90 hp cubs to 180 hp,PA18 , PA12, J5 or even J3 stripped down and/or modified. Pa18-180 modified seems to be the ticket.I thought that one of the operators towed with a CC this season, but I could be wrong. Maybe Steve can confirm if you can get a restricted cert. on a CC, legend or any other than factory built plane. At least two glider operations use a 160 SC, whereas most go with a Pawnee.
    Last edited by Xargos; 03-18-2017 at 10:15 PM.

  38. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xargos View Post
    Few operators I know around here fly turbines, rarely you can see a radial Ag-Cat/Thrush.I suspect cub covers less ground per day and dusting is time sensitive. There are hard working cubs in the NE though:banner towing at low level, hot, every day, long hours etc...Some fly out of paved fields some from grass. They range from standard 90 hp cubs to 180 hp,PA18 , PA12, J5 or even J3 stripped down and/or modified. Pa18-180 modified seems to be the ticket.I thought that one of the operators towed with a CC this season, but I could be wrong. Maybe Steve can confirm if you can get a restricted cert. on a CC, legend or any other than factory built plane. At least two glider operations use a 160 SC, whereas most go with a Pawnee.
    I was referring to the 80's when I worked at the airport. Wasn't many turbines in the NE at the time. Banner towing has always been a cub thing, but in the grand scheme not a big market there up here. Cities and beaches. My impression is that it would be a hard business to make money in, so I doubt a CC would fit into that business plan.


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  39. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eddie Foy View Post
    Who makes the carbon fiber belly pod?
    Eddie - http://cubcrafters.com/c/2017/03/81-days/
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  40. #80

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