Page 9 of 10 FirstFirst ... 78910 LastLast
Results 321 to 360 of 367

Thread: ADS-B Mandate

  1. #321
    mvivion's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Bozeman,MT
    Posts
    9,802
    Post Thanks / Like
    The military has stated that they will not adopt ADS-B either.

    MTV
    Likes Jim Hann liked this post

  2. #322
    sjohnson's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Boise, ID
    Posts
    563
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Pierce View Post
    and the airlines are asking for an exemption to the ADSB mandate. GAis getting screwed by them and the big avionics manufactures in my opinion. EAA and AOPA did very little to help, of course their big advertisers are making a lot of money off of it.
    As I understand it, the airlines already got an exemption from the required newer, higher accuracy GPS until 2025, but must install the rest of ADS-B Out by 2020. The stated reason is that certification is needed for each airliner model and variant, volumes are low, and certified units won't be available in time for installation.

    Added: this is another example of FAA certification standards getting in the way of its own objectives. Satellite tracking is another area. Instead of making it easier to certify and upgrade the GPS, the FAA relaxed accuracy and moved the deadline. I was talking with an airline pilot friend and marveling that my Cub had more modern navigation and tracking than many airliners, when he pointed out that it costs nearly $100k to install a GPS in an airliner.

    https://www.faa.gov/nextgen/equipads...ption12555.pdf
    Last edited by sjohnson; 10-30-2017 at 02:15 PM. Reason: Tupo
    Democracy dies in conformity
    Likes mike mcs repair liked this post

  3. #323
    CamTom12's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Huntsville, AL
    Posts
    425
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by mvivion View Post
    The military has stated that they will not adopt ADS-B either.

    MTV
    Where’d you hear that?

  4. #324

    Join Date
    May 2017
    Posts
    182
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by CamTom12 View Post
    Where’d you hear that?
    Navy is in the process of equipping. I believe AF told FAA they would not be in compliance by 1/1/2020


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  5. #325
    CamTom12's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Huntsville, AL
    Posts
    425
    Post Thanks / Like
    That’s what I was tracking. Working towards but not complete on time for all the services

  6. #326
    mvivion's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Bozeman,MT
    Posts
    9,802
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by CamTom12 View Post
    Where’d you hear that?
    That was on one of the national aviation news sites. I don’t think it was a “we’re not going there” thing, but the difficulty and expense of integrating this technology into the avionics in some Aircraft would delay compliance, perhaps substantially.

    MTV

  7. #327
    CamTom12's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Huntsville, AL
    Posts
    425
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by mvivion View Post
    That was on one of the national aviation news sites. I don’t think it was a “we’re not going there” thing, but the difficulty and expense of integrating this technology into the avionics in some Aircraft would delay compliance, perhaps substantially.

    MTV
    Yeah, I agree with that. Especially the integrated avionics suites - very difficult.

  8. #328
    hotrod180's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Port Townsend, WA
    Posts
    1,906
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by mvivion View Post
    ... the difficulty and expense of integrating this technology into the avionics in some Aircraft would delay compliance, perhaps substantially.
    "Difficulty and expense..." -- oh yeah, me too.
    I gotta remember that line for when it's 2020 and I haven't met the mandate.
    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!

  9. #329
    spinner2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Montana
    Posts
    1,649
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by spinner2 View Post
    I looked on Garmin's site and it sounds as though the GDL 39, which receives both the 978 and 1090 frequencies, will get an ADS-B out direct from the other airplane. Though it is not refered to as air-to-air online. I thought it had to be rebroadcast by a tower.

    In this case he was about 2000' higher and closer to the ground tower than I was and we both had good radar coverage. So he should have seen me as a Mode C target through a rebroadcast.

    Good to know. The more I use this system the more I like it. Thanks for the replies.

    I got an email from Garmin today saying that they have the GTX 335 transponder with a WAAS GPS on sale for just under $3000 now. That was the price without the GPS. Plus there is the $500 FAA rebate.
    I had another target pop up on my 796 that I can’t explain. Yesterday I was flying east, at a VFR altitude, through a canyon below radar and ADSB coverage. Slightly ahead of me and probably 1000’ below was opposite direction traffic. The canyon here is maybe a mile wide but plenty of room for both of us. I looked at my 796 and there he was behind me now with the gap widening. The target was a black diamond like rebroadcast Mode C traffic looks. No N number associated with it. So I don’t think he had ADSB Out for that reason and also because I didn’t see him on the 796 ahead of me, just when he was abeam and behind me.

    It would seem that the GDL 39 was picking up his transponder directly. A few days earlier I did a software update on the 796 and one of the changes, so it said, was an improvement of ADSB targets. A connection?

    Anybody else seeing this type of target when you know you’re out of both ADSB and radar coverage?
    "Fast is fine, but accuracy is everything." Wyatt Earp

  10. #330
    hotrod180's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Port Townsend, WA
    Posts
    1,906
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by spinner2 View Post
    ....The target was a black diamond like rebroadcast Mode C traffic looks. No N number associated with it. So I don’t think he had ADSB Out for that reason and also because I didn’t see him on the 796 ahead of me, just when he was abeam and behind me. ....
    What I do about ADS-B you could out in a thimble (and have room left over),
    but I was just reading up on the Garmin GDL82 and I believe Garmin says it has an "anonymous" mode where it will not show the tail number on other folk's ADS-b "in" display.
    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!

  11. #331
    marc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Boise,IDAHO
    Posts
    253
    Post Thanks / Like
    How Levil aviation doing getting a certification.


    Sent from my iPad using SuperCub.Org
    t-cart n43643

  12. #332

    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Location
    Farmersville, TX
    Posts
    271
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by hotrod180 View Post
    What I do about ADS-B you could out in a thimble (and have room left over),
    but I was just reading up on the Garmin GDL82 and I believe Garmin says it has an "anonymous" mode where it will not show the tail number on other folk's ADS-b "in" display.
    There is a provision in the TSO for 978-UAT units to broadcast in "anonymous" mode while squawking 1200 (VFR). This would result in no N-number displayed, and no aircraft information. But as soon as you enter a discrete transponder code, it begins transmitting your N-number, ICAO identifier, etc. (just like the 1090-ES units, where "anonymous mode is NOT ever allowed). So it is possible that is what was going on. I think it's more likely that Garmin displayed the wrong symbol when it saw an "anonymous" target, because a "Mode-C only" transponder does not "broadcast" anything - it only "replies" to interrogations by radar. If spinner2 was seeing positional updates for that target that were "fluid" (not jumping from position to position based on a new radar sweep), it was almost certainly ADS-B OUT equipped.
    Jim Parker
    '65 Champion 7ECA - Flying
    ?? Bearhawk Patrol - Building
    Thanks spinner2 thanked for this post
    Likes moneyburner liked this post

  13. #333
    spinner2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Montana
    Posts
    1,649
    Post Thanks / Like
    Jim I couldn’t see it long enough to see if it was jumpy. I know what you’re referring to by that. It didn’t show until it was a abeam me and because we were flying opposite directions it didn’t stay on the 796 for long.

    An anonymous UAT seems possible. I saw this same phenonomen once before and I talked to the pilot. He said he had a common Mode C transponder and yet he was on my 796 and I had no ADSB coverage but we both were in radar coverage.

    The GDL 82 is an interesting option. I downloaded the manual and you can install a switch to turn the anonymity on or off at the pilot’s discretion. And it can be on only when you’re squawking 1200. When turned off or squawking an ATC code it displays your N number.
    "Fast is fine, but accuracy is everything." Wyatt Earp

  14. #334
    skywagon8a's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    SE Mass
    Posts
    7,868
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by spinner2 View Post
    Jim I couldn’t see it long enough to see if it was jumpy. I know what you’re referring to by that. It didn’t show until it was a abeam me and because we were flying opposite directions it didn’t stay on the 796 for long.
    Just an uneducated guess, the other traffic's antenna was mounted on it's belly so your airplane didn't see the signal until he was passing you.
    N1PA
    Likes spinner2, kestrel liked this post

  15. #335
    spinner2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Montana
    Posts
    1,649
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by skywagon8a View Post
    Just an uneducated guess, the other traffic's antenna was mounted on it's belly so your airplane didn't see the signal until he was passing you.
    Could be. The ADSB Out uses a blade type transponder antenna and it should be mounted on the bottom side. The plane looked like a Husky/Cub from the brief look I got. A blue and white one on skis. My engine and his engine could well have been blocking the signal. My GDL39 is mounted above the panel.

    He he was below me and not offset to the side by much.

    However it it worked I remain impressed with the technology and system. Even living in an area with somewhat spotty coverage. I’ve wondered why the ADSB towers are all placed in valleys instead of the tops of mountains? Most of the radar installations are up high. Missoula being the only exception I can think of. All of the ADSB towers are down at airports or close to them.
    "Fast is fine, but accuracy is everything." Wyatt Earp
    Thanks PA-12 on Baumanns thanked for this post

  16. #336
    skywagon8a's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    SE Mass
    Posts
    7,868
    Post Thanks / Like
    ADSB towers being in the valleys means that they can more easily see the belly mounted antennas.
    N1PA

  17. #337
    fobjob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Salt Lake City, Utah
    Posts
    1,979
    Post Thanks / Like
    The next add-on will be a splitter and top mounted “diversity” antenna for coverage by satellite in very scarcely occupied areas....thanks to MH370..... there are quite a few satellites (Iridium) scheduled for launch with an add-on ads-b system aboard....this will also help eliminate any blindness due to shadowing...
    Last edited by fobjob; 02-14-2018 at 03:04 PM.

  18. #338
    fobjob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Salt Lake City, Utah
    Posts
    1,979
    Post Thanks / Like
    Anyone know where on the tax form to declare the rebate? No 1099 as the amount was under 600...
    Last edited by fobjob; 04-01-2018 at 05:52 PM.
    Likes flyboyrv3 liked this post

  19. #339

    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Location
    Farmersville, TX
    Posts
    271
    Post Thanks / Like
    I just listed it on a worksheet, and added the $500 to my "other income" field. That's how Turbo Tax did it.
    Jim Parker
    '65 Champion 7ECA - Flying
    ?? Bearhawk Patrol - Building

  20. #340

    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    P.O. Box 6Archbald, Pa. 18403
    Posts
    77
    Post Thanks / Like
    These last two comments are because of April Fool's day right??
    Please say it is.
    Please.

  21. #341
    fobjob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Salt Lake City, Utah
    Posts
    1,979
    Post Thanks / Like
    The rebate is taxable, but no 1099

    is provided, because the total amount was less than 600 bucks...the article in Avweb this morning, about the postponement of the adsb deadline until 2040, WAS a prank...at least, it better be...

    Jim, do you remember what worksheet?

  22. #342

    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Location
    Farmersville, TX
    Posts
    271
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by fobjob View Post
    The rebate is taxable, but no 1099

    is provided, because the total amount was less than 600 bucks...the article in Avweb this morning, about the postponement of the adsb deadline until 2040, WAS a prank...at least, it better be...

    Jim, do you remember what worksheet?
    The one where you list miscellaneous income. It doesn’t get filed — TT just uses it to determine how much income you had, in case you had more than one source of “non-1099” income.

    A “friend” works for the IRS, and says they know if you got a rebate... So including it when you file is just common sense. Why give them a reason to audit you, over a measly $500 in income?
    Jim Parker
    '65 Champion 7ECA - Flying
    ?? Bearhawk Patrol - Building

  23. #343

    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Nikiski , AK
    Posts
    327
    Post Thanks / Like
    oops

  24. #344
    hotrod180's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Port Townsend, WA
    Posts
    1,906
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by fobjob View Post
    ...the article in Avweb this morning, about the postponement of the adsb deadline until 2040, WAS a prank...at least, it better be......
    This is the post that deserves the "Please say it is. Please" comment.
    April fools, but we can always hope.....
    Cessna Skywagon-- accept no substitute!

  25. #345
    fobjob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Salt Lake City, Utah
    Posts
    1,979
    Post Thanks / Like
    Thanks, gang...back to the original topic of this thread, ten Iridium sats got launched yesterday, trying to find out if the adsb monitors were on them...of course, they still only go as far north as Juneau’s latitude, so everything north of there is a slant shot, might be problematic.
    Last edited by fobjob; 04-02-2018 at 02:03 PM.

  26. #346
    fobjob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Salt Lake City, Utah
    Posts
    1,979
    Post Thanks / Like
    OK, from what I’ve been able to wade through this morning, fifty Iridiums have already been launched with the adsb receivers aboard. I found ONE statement that indicated that they ONLY monitor 1090 MHz, so, if true, then Alaska cubs and Canada transiting planes had better plan on extended squitter mode S transponders and not 978 MHz equipment....
    there were also vague statements that the ground portion of the system would become operational towards the end of 2018.
    This kinda makes sense, as the transponder pulses are about 250 Watts, and the 978 equipment pulses are a lot less....

    NavCanada is a program participant....
    Last edited by fobjob; 04-03-2018 at 10:28 PM.

  27. #347
    Jim Hann's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Ballwin, MO
    Posts
    61
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by JimParker256 View Post
    The one where you list miscellaneous income. It doesn’t get filed — TT just uses it to determine how much income you had, in case you had more than one source of “non-1099” income.

    A “friend” works for the IRS, and says they know if you got a rebate... So including it when you file is just common sense. Why give them a reason to audit you, over a measly $500 in income?
    Just talked to my CPA about this since I didn't tell them about the $500. Her opinion is that isn't taxable income since it was a rebate against the purchase of the equipment. However, being the gubmint we know they want as much money as they can get... Actually her comment was "they are erring on the conservative side. Does the FAA have fine print saying that they are not qualified to give tax advise?"

    I'll be watching this, if I see comments that folks are getting letters (which is probably where they would start, not audits) then we'll open up the returns and amend them.

    Thanks for the heads up!

    Jim
    PS, sorry for the thread drift.

  28. #348
    fobjob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Salt Lake City, Utah
    Posts
    1,979
    Post Thanks / Like
    Interesting. Actually, it’s not a “rebate” against the purchase of equipment, but the timely installation of same. Might make a difference.
    A “reward”, and not a “rebate”.......

  29. #349

    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    1,279
    Post Thanks / Like
    I am not a tax guy, but, If I had already paid income tax on the money I used to buy the equipment, why would I need to pay more income tax if they gave some of it back to me?
    DENNY

  30. #350
    Gordon Misch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Toledo, Wa (KTDO)
    Posts
    2,920
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by DENNY View Post
    I am not a tax guy, but, If I had already paid income tax on the money I used to buy the equipment, why would I need to pay more income tax if they gave some of it back to me?
    DENNY
    Maybe if the gross, pre-rebate cost of installation had been taken as a deductible expense?
    Gordon

    N4328M KTDO
    My SPOT: tinyurl.com/N4328M (case sensitive)

  31. #351
    fobjob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Salt Lake City, Utah
    Posts
    1,979
    Post Thanks / Like
    Gordon Baxter once said:”How much money does it take to do aviation?” Ans: “All of it....”
    Likes Dave Sherwood, Jim Hann liked this post

  32. #352
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Graham, TX
    Posts
    17,375
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by fobjob View Post
    The rebate is taxable, but no 1099

    is provided, because the total amount was less than 600 bucks...the article in Avweb this morning, about the postponement of the adsb deadline until 2040, WAS a prank...at least, it better be...

    Jim, do you remember what worksheet?
    The accountant I am married to asked why you would report it. It is money you didn't spend on the ADSB, like discounting the price. It is not income.
    Steve Pierce

    Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects.
    Will Rogers
    Thanks 40m, Jim Hann thanked for this post

  33. #353
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Graham, TX
    Posts
    17,375
    Post Thanks / Like
    Steve Pierce

    Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects.
    Will Rogers

  34. #354

    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    1,332
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Pierce View Post
    The accountant I am married to asked why you would report it. It is money you didn't spend on the ADSB, like discounting the price. It is not income.
    Steve I think this is one of those apples and oranges things. Garmin didn't give me the rebate, the FAA did. Unfortunately that sounds like income to me.
    Likes N86250 liked this post

  35. #355
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Graham, TX
    Posts
    17,375
    Post Thanks / Like
    Then report it as income, no harm in that.
    Steve Pierce

    Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects.
    Will Rogers

  36. #356

    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    3,313
    Post Thanks / Like
    The government knows what "rebate" means.

    re·bate1noun

    ˈrēˌbāt/

    • 1.
      a partial refund to someone who has paid too much money for tax, rent, or a utility.
      synonyms: refund, partial refund, repayment; More





  37. #357

    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Location
    Farmersville, TX
    Posts
    271
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Pierce View Post
    The FAA's ADS-B Rebate web site has FAQs, including one as to whether the rebate is taxable: https://www.faa.gov/nextgen/equipadsb/rebate/faq/#q0205 Here's the relevant portion:

    Is the rebate payment considered as taxable income?

    Yes, the $500 is taxable income. Rebate payment recipients are required to report it on the appropriate tax return.
    Will I receive a 1099 form from FAA for the rebate payment?

    1099 forms are only required for taxable income exceeding $600. FAA will not send a 1099 form to any Rebate recipient.

    A "rebate" check from the federal government is NOT a "discount" from the manufacturer, as discussed in the Turbo-Tax "cash-back rewards" answer. Again, why invite an audit over $500 in income? But I suppose we all have different levels of risk tolerance... Not worth saving $100-150 in taxes to me.
    Jim Parker
    '65 Champion 7ECA - Flying
    ?? Bearhawk Patrol - Building
    Likes Eddy Lewis liked this post

  38. #358

    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    3,313
    Post Thanks / Like
    That's nuts. It isn't income. It's an incentive rebate. You already paid taxes on the money you spent on the equipment.

  39. #359
    skywagon8a's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    SE Mass
    Posts
    7,868
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by JimParker256 View Post
    A "rebate" check from the federal government is NOT a "discount" from the manufacturer, as discussed in the Turbo-Tax "cash-back rewards" answer.
    Yet the federal government used the incentive of the $500 to cause the purchase of the equipment. Some people would not have made the purchase had not the government issued the incentive. The government (FAA) was incentivising the purchase by issuing the "rebate". I agree with stewartb.
    N1PA

  40. #360
    Jim Hann's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Ballwin, MO
    Posts
    61
    Post Thanks / Like
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Pierce View Post
    The accountant I am married to asked why you would report it. It is money you didn't spend on the ADSB, like discounting the price. It is not income.
    Quote Originally Posted by qsmx440 View Post
    Steve I think this is one of those apples and oranges things. Garmin didn't give me the rebate, the FAA did. Unfortunately that sounds like income to me.
    Quote Originally Posted by JimParker256 View Post
    The FAA's ADS-B Rebate web site has FAQs, including one as to whether the rebate is taxable: https://www.faa.gov/nextgen/equipadsb/rebate/faq/#q0205 Here's the relevant portion:

    Is the rebate payment considered as taxable income?

    Yes, the $500 is taxable income. Rebate payment recipients are required to report it on the appropriate tax return.
    Will I receive a 1099 form from FAA for the rebate payment?

    1099 forms are only required for taxable income exceeding $600. FAA will not send a 1099 form to any Rebate recipient.

    A "rebate" check from the federal government is NOT a "discount" from the manufacturer, as discussed in the Turbo-Tax "cash-back rewards" answer. Again, why invite an audit over $500 in income? But I suppose we all have different levels of risk tolerance... Not worth saving $100-150 in taxes to me.
    Quote Originally Posted by stewartb View Post
    That's nuts. It isn't income. It's an incentive rebate. You already paid taxes on the money you spent on the equipment.
    My CPA agrees with Steve's CPA, thank you Cathy! I agree with y'all, but it is the government, they have one hand out whilst the other is behind your back picking your pocket.

    Like my CPA said, is the FAA really qualified to give tax advice???
    Likes Steve Pierce liked this post

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •