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Generator for pre-heat?

Glenn,
Please put that jury-rigged weed burner to work boiling crabs, clams, lobsters, etc,....and NOT on your plane. That really nice looking plane in your avatar deserves better. Trying to save a few bucks on a pre-heating system is penny-wise and pound-foolish. (how's that for an old-fashinoned saying ?)

Jim W
 
Kerm's quick start. Yeah I had one for awhile. Even used it a couple of times without burning down my airplane. Soon as I could afford something better, I took it down to Stoddards so they could sell it for me on their consignment table. Problem with them is the propane tank -it's heavy and the propane doesn't vaporize very well at very cold temps. I had a tough time keeping it lit at temps colder than 20 below.

If you have a power source (plug in or generator) it's hard to beat a Reiff. The Whamo catalalytic is also a good solution if you can find one. Stewart's ammo box heater with a MSR stove works really well too. The Northern Companion is another good portable combustion heater. These are the ones I have used with generally good results, but you do need to pay attention and not let the flames get too close to anything that can melt or catch fire.
 
Dave Calkins said:
Mike, I'd like to hear the "facts" about that one. Is it possible someone misspoke about the heater type?

Also, BEWARE!!!!! There are cheap automotive interior heaters with plastic cases that have damaged several airplanes. Apparently the bearings on the fan give up and the fan seizes, then plastic case melts and catches fire. Several Cessna 206's (!!?) had engine compartment damge due to these. Rust's flying service was one of these incidents.
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Dave I will try to run it down, but I am sure it was a catalytic heater of some type. I am sure TH is out guiding, maybe MCS Mike Skup knows details. I will remember to ask TH and report back, but it might be a while.

For sure Dave you are right about those cheap interior heaters. Ron Eagly (aka Gwennies owner) had his cessna have one of those things spool bearings and melt down. Thats why the Tannis interior heater is so good. Solid design, true thermostat, and built and TESTED to be bullet proof. Worth the extra money if you go the route of a car interior heater. Tanis builds them up in the summer for stock, then once they sell out they can't do anything but put you on a back order list. NOW would be a good time to get one, not January as they get so busy with their other products that they cannot spool up to build them in the winter.

Excellent SB, it is an easy install on the Honda breather heat kit. Sounds like their price has gone up a bit, or the 2000 kit is more than the 1000 kit. Still dirt cheap compare to a tear down and crank seal replacement. More classy than the cardboard box too.
 
Slit the line, no need for a kit. The cardboard box is more for carb ice, these little gennes get it.
 
My Honda 1000 got so leaded up from 100LL it quit. No compression, valves/seats were packed with lead and quit working. Do not run leaded gas in your Honda 1000-2000....Bigger Hondas have hotter exhaust gas and will scavenge the lead....my 2500 Honda will and has burned about every kind of gas with no ill effect (5.5hp)....live and learn as they say.
 
skywagon8a said:
Yes the little 2hp Honda is a 4-stroke. When running on 100LL, after a while it starts to cut out and then quits. I then clean a little thread of lead from the plug gap and it runs fine for another long time. It always starts on the first pull.
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Just to be clear, I do not use 100LL exclusively. Only at the end and beginning of the season. Primarily use is to flush out any car gas during long term storage. However my Sears lawn mower has never used anything but 100LL.
 
You can always use one of the lead scavenger products (Decalin is one) the/us Rotax guys use when forced to use avgas. One qt would suffice for a few years what with the low gph of the 1K generators.
 
I am another fan of Honda inverters! They only seem expensive until you use one. Extremely fuel efficient and quiet.

I found an oil neck extender for my 2000i on eBay that makes oil changes a breeze. It is a simple aluminum tube with one end threaded to fit the dipstick hole.
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I decided to go with the Honda 1000i. I had a BFR scheduled at S27, Kalispell City and following that went over to Murdoch's Farm & Ranch Supply, which is located between the runway and the highway and made the purchase. Two need-to-do things taken care of.

I appreciate the informative responses.

Here it is buckled into the back seat ready to fly home.

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Amazing machines. One of my Yamaha EF1000s was under flood waters for 5 days. When I finally got there to address it I found no water in the fuel tank or crankcase but I drained and refilled them anyway. No water in the cylinder. Three pulls to blow the water out of the exhaust and it started on the fourth pull. Makes power like it never got wet. PFC (pretty cool).
 
Lots. I'm sick of the rain.

And since it's a ski flying forum... I'm really looking forward to getting the 180 back on the Fluidynes this season!
 
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spinner2 said:
Thanks for the recommendations. Will these run on 100LL without problems?
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skywagon8a said:
I run my 2hp Honda outboard motor on 100LL. The only thing that I have noticed is that the spark plug needs to have the lead cleaned out once in a while. A little thread of lead shorts out the spark gap.
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I have been running my little Honda outboard on regular ethanol car gas during the summer. Just recently, I ran it around to burn out the car gas and then put in 100LL for the winter. I don't know if it was my imagination, but it seemed to have a little less power on the 100LL. I usually do this winter change over in fresh water but this time it was in salt water. I had never noticed the difference in the fresh, but this time it just seemed as though the little extra buoyancy of the salt allowed the boat to go just a little faster with the car gas.
 
Here's the little Honda eu1000i I bought last fall earning its keep now.
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I have been looking to get the Honda 1000. But a bud of mine says they wont start below +20 F. (he isn't a pilot and is mechanically inept as well). Do you need to pre heat the generator to get it to start? Or are they firing up when cold soaked? I'd like to get away from flame power pre heat and don't wish to keep the genie warm on an overniter, doesn't seem practical.
 
Hey Gary, I would have to disagree on the 100LL issue. The lead sits on the valve faces, stems, seats, guides and on top of the piston. I used MMO and TCP and eventually lost compression due to the lead build-up. I was using the generator in cold conditions (to preheat) and would always preheat the generator. Use un-leaded only in the 1000 Honda... The small Honda won't get the EGT hot enough to scavenge the lead in 100LL....
Skukum 12, the Honda can be preheated but it is a pain. When I was winter camping I would bring the gen into the tent to warm it up. Preheating the preheater. I did an early spring skiing trip in the western brooks and cold soaked that Gen for ten days at -20F overnight temps. Bringing it in the tent with just a small single mantle lantern was enough to get it to start. But if you don't have a way to warm it up, it won't start cold.... Has anyone had any experience with the Yamaha 1000? My Honda is still in pieces.....
 
look at the black cat heaters if you don't want to drag a gen set... some little ones out there. Much easier to put a little propane bottle in your tent than a gen set.

Yamaha has not been quite as tough as honda over many years it seems, nor as popular. But it seems to always come down to storing out of the rain/salt spray, and keeping CLEAN GAS in it. Don't expect anyting to work with two year old gas these days
 
The only reason I own a Honda EU2000i is as an emergency generator for when my pickup won't start after a weekend of riding snowmachines. In the 10+ years of Duramax ownership that's meant the trucks were exposed to sustained temps colder than -20* for days. The generator rides inside the snowgo trailer so it's at the same temps. It starts. Not on the first pull, for sure, but it's never failed to start. The coldest report I can offer is after three days at colder than -40* although the temp was up to -38* when I got to the truck. Pirep? My Honda starts in the cold as long as the fuel is good and the spark plug is healthy. Those conditions are critical. No avgas in my gennie. Not the Honda, anyway. Not if I expect it to start when I need it. I've made that mistake, and the avgas had Mystery Oil in it.
 
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sierra bravo said:
The only reason I own a Honda EU2000i is as an emergency generator for when my pickup won't start after a weekend of riding snowmachines. In the 10+ years of Duramax ownership that's meant the trucks were exposed to sustained temps colder than -20* for days. The generator rides inside the snowgo trailer so it's at the same temps. It starts. Not on the first pull, for sure, but it's never failed to start. The coldest report I can offer is after three days at colder than -40* although the temp was up to -38* when I got to the truck. Pirep? My Honda starts in the cold as long as the fuel is good and the spark plug is healthy. Those conditions are critical. No avgas in my gennie. Not the Honda, anyway. Not if I expect it to start when I need it. I've made that mistake, and the avgas had Mystery Oil in it.
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The only thing I can add to Stewart's comment is that my EU2000i needed to have a box placed over it while it was running at -30 with a little breeze in order to keep it running. It would always start but without enough load on it it would quit after 20 mins or so. I set a box over the top and left it up on the box flaps so that it still got some fresh air. That was enough to raise the ambient temp and it would run until it ran out gas. Now I keep a knocked down box in the 180 in case I need to preheat at really cold temps.
 
I've never heard of that but my generator gets loaded if it's running. I need most of the capacity on those cold days, otherwise I'd have stuck with my Yamaha 1000 I use for the plane. I always have a rubbermaid tote sitting around so I have a box of sorts. Thanks for the tip.

Does your gennie have the cold weather kit installed? I haven't done mine yet. I suppose I need to get 'er done. Here's a link to the kit part #s if anyone is interested. http://www.babbittshondageneratorhouse.com/category/145/cold-weather-kits
 
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Stewart

it doesn't have the cold weather kit, thanks for the link. I will have to try it..
 
After the recent snow storm, when there were wide spread power outages, I have received authorization from the budget department to upgrade our household auxiliary generator. The current one is an old no name generic 2kw that will only run for 2 hours on a tank of gas. Also it doesn't have enough power to open the hangar door. Based on all the above posts it seems that a brand of choice would be Honda. So, I am considering a new Honda EU6500is. It seems as though it will fit into our situation with the least amount of complications with more than enough nice clean power. What say all of you? Do any of you have any experience or opinions with this particular generator?
 
skukum12 said:
I have been looking to get the Honda 1000. But a bud of mine says they wont start below +20 F. (he isn't a pilot and is mechanically inept as well). Do you need to pre heat the generator to get it to start? Or are they firing up when cold soaked? I'd like to get away from flame power pre heat and don't wish to keep the genie warm on an overniter, doesn't seem practical.
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You are mis-informed on that. I have started my Honda 1000 at -40 with full synthetic oil in it. Usually run 5W-20W Mobil 1 synthetic. Routinely start it at -20. Stewart is right, as long as the gas is good and sparkplug they will go. However, I did blow the crank seals out of one my Honda 1000's in McGrath last year when it was -46 because the breather froze. Honda makes a cold weather kit with a heated and insulated breather for $60. Both of mine have it on them now. But the bush guys just put a cardboard box over it. That would work at homebase, but what if you set down somewhere, you overnight, it gets really cold and your seals puke like mine did because you didn't have a cardbord box in your plane? Of course your satphone (you do have one with you right) is dead from cold too. Especially with those skinny little PA-18s with not much cargo area to hold a big box. Put the cold weather kit in is my advice if you are going out and want to rely on your little Honda.
 
dalec said:
The only thing I can add to Stewart's comment is that my EU2000i needed to have a box placed over it while it was running at -30 with a little breeze in order to keep it running. It would always start but without enough load on it it would quit after 20 mins or so. I set a box over the top and left it up on the box flaps so that it still got some fresh air. That was enough to raise the ambient temp and it would run until it ran out gas. Now I keep a knocked down box in the 180 in case I need to preheat at really cold temps.
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Dalec... Try running it with partial choke on when it gets below -20. The air is so dense you need really to re-jet, but putting 1/4 choke on will enrichen it enough so they run. SOP for me, mine purr with a little choke on. I figured this out by having it quit and restart, quit, and so on. Pulled the plug and it was scary white indicating lean. Then I thought about the air/fuel mixture due to the cold. Same on your plane, when its real cold and you go full throttle you are going to be leaner than normal operating temps, adding some carb heat is a good safety measure to richen the fuel/air mixture. You are going to be maxing some big manifold pressure too and horsepower baby.

Here is a shot of 79H, RIP, at Rohn last year, preheating at -38F with a Honda 1000.

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Dale C:

are you in SGY? Strip is hard enough to drive on with the atv...

Skywagon, no experience with that model, but if the engine says 'Honda', it will work good. think about the electric remote start... then for long term power outage you can just sit inside and start when you want!
 
skywagon8a said:
After the recent snow storm, when there were wide spread power outages, I have received authorization from the budget department to upgrade our household auxiliary generator. The current one is an old no name generic 2kw that will only run for 2 hours on a tank of gas. Also it doesn't have enough power to open the hangar door. Based on all the above posts it seems that a brand of choice would be Honda. So, I am considering a new Honda EU6500is. It seems as though it will fit into our situation with the least amount of complications with more than enough nice clean power. What say all of you? Do any of you have any experience or opinions with this particular generator?
Click to expand...
That's what I have. That particular unit has surge output that'll handle momentary power draws in excess of 6500w. Mine runs my whole house including forced air heat and a well, the two most important things to power. Make sure you do a bypass switch to protect the utility's linemen and check local codes about the install. A portable with a plug has different rules than a hard wired gennie on an auto start.
 
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