New Garmin GDL 39 - XM WX killer?

[Bugs66]

I saw this cool new product announced today by Garmin, the GDL 39 portable ADS-B unit for wx and traffic. Works with all recent Garmin GPS, such as 796, Aera's, etc. Also can work with iPad.
https://buy.garmin.com/shop/shop.do?pID=93601
FAQs: http://garmin.blogs.com/my_weblog/20...l-39-faqs.html
Current ADS-B Coverage map: http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/...coverage01.png
cf-md.jpg

I have been frustrated with the XM WX and the very slow refresh of WX data. Has anyone else? This new GDL looks to be the cat's meow.

I would be curious if anyone has tried this with an Aera 500 series yet. I have a 510 am seriously considering and dumping the XM WX for this.

[sjohnson]

This looks like a great product. My concern is getting weather info in the mountains at low altitudes AGL. It would be best to get weather info before takeoff, but I can live with soon after takeoff. Anyone have experience with ADS-B units in the mountainous northwest?

[Bugs66]

I was thinking about mountain scenario also, however as you said, soon after take off you should be able to pick up ADS-B.

Another thought I have had recently is the traffic information. With all the UAV's planned is starting to give me concern for the future and collision avoidance.

[hottshot]

monthly cost? Free? subscription? Don't see that info...


Check that ... first paragraph


Now how much??




AirVenture is buzzing about Garmin's new GDL 39 portable ADS-B receiver. And many people are coming by the Garmin exhibit to see it in person and ask questions. Here are answers to some of the common questions we're hearing:

What do I get with the GDL 39?
The GDL 39 delivers subscription-free weather and datalink traffic information to your mobile device (think iPad or Android tablet) or your Garmin aviation portable. It also has a WAAS GPS receiver to optimize the accuracy and reliability of the position information displayed on your mobile device.

Does the GDL 39 meet the requirements for ADS-B Out?
No. The GDL 39 is an ADS-B In receiver only. To meet the requirements for ADS-B Out, check out the GDL 88 series or the GTX 330 ES. If you're not sure which one is right for your airplane, you can plan your ADS-B installation online at our ADS-B Academy.

What does it mean that the GDL 39 is "dual-link"?
Because the FAA permits ADS-B broadcasts on 2 frequencies (978 UAT and 1090 ES), the GDL 39 contains both receivers so you can see a comprehensive view of all ADS-B Out equipped targets, regardless of which frequency they're using.

Which traffic targets will I see?
The GDL 39 allows you to receive position reports directly from other ADS-B Out equipped aircraft. ADS-B In technology also allows the GDL 39 to receive Traffic Information Service-Broadcast (TIS-B) information. TIS-B allows you to view the same dynamic traffic picture that ATC ground controllers are seeing when you're either participating with an ADS-B Out solution or within a certain range of another ADS-B Out participating aircraft when within a service area. In order to maximize available traffic information for the display, the aircraft should also be equipped with a compliant ADS-B Out solution like the GDL 88 series or GTX 330 ES/33/23 ES transponders.

What products are compatible with the GDL 39?
Any mobile device running the Garmin Pilot app is compatible with the GDL 39 and can be connected wirelessly via Bluetooth. The GDL 39 is also compatible with select Garmin aviation portables and can be connected with a single cable. These include the aera 796/795, GPSMAP 696/695, aera 500 series and G3X.

Can the GDL 39 connect to multiple devices simultaneously?
Yes. The GDL 39 allows up to three devices to be connected simultaneously - two via Bluetooth and one via cable connection.

Are there any discounts or special deals for the GDL 39?
Yes. If you purchase a GDL 39 before August 31st, you are eligible for a mail-in rebate to receive a free battery and carrying case.

Have more questions about the GDL 39? For more information, visit our ADS-B Academy or stop by the Garmin booth in Hangar D at AirVenture.

[behindpropellers]

Free!!

Nope. Our user fees will help pay

[SC3CM]

If you're looking at this as 'free WX' replacement to XM, make sure you REALLY understand the differences and how those compare to what you like or don't like about XM. You may like the ADS-B wx a lot less. It is not the same and does not have the same info available.

Also understand the requirements to become ADS-B compliant. This may not get you all the way there. You may need to add/change something, so should be well informed before buying anything. 2020 may not be next year, but why throw good $ away.

As for flying a cub with an iPad, I still haven't figured out how anyone does that


Rene

[Bugs66]

Hey Guys, I got one ordered. Will give a pirep with Aera 510 in next few weeks.

[Bill Rusk]

Thanks Christian.

Bill

[spinner2]

Good for you Bugs. It will be interesting to hear about how well it works in places like we flew last spring; deep valleys.

Still thinking BC might be possible in August.

And the gravel is showing finally in the Clark Fork.


Sent from my iPhone from the middle of nowhere using Tapatalk

[mvivion]

Two issues:

1) This service (ADS-B) is totally reliant on ground based transmitters, and not all those are installed yet. So, in mountainous country, according to a fellow familiar with the system, you may have to be well above 10000 feet msl to receive a signal, depending on where you're at. ADS-B is designed as an IFR system, frankly. XM on the other hand, is satellite transmitted.

2) These devices are NOT an ADS-B device. They don't transmit, so are incapable of ADS-B Out, which will be required in some airspace in a 2020, AND, they will only show traffic that is TRANSMITTING ADS-B Out. They are not a real ADS-B device, although they're using the ADS-B GBTs to receive data.

Finally, as noted previously, the data isn't of the same quality as XM.

It'll be interesting to see who comes out with what next.

MTV

[Bugs66]

MTV, take a look at the coverage map above to see the altitudes. If you are in the mountains, often you are at high altitude to begin with. I think it is a given with these ADS units that you need to get airborne most of the time to get a signal.

As far as quality, all I can tell you is the initial reports coming in are that the WX data is very good. The XM Lite package is $35/mo and does not give winds aloft, AIRMETS, SIGMETS, PIREPS, surface analysis, which should be available with the GDL-39.

There should be a lot of fresh pireps coming in as many of these units were purchased at Oshkosh. Will be interested to read. I will also report on my experience with unit.

Here is a write up by AOPA http://www.aopa.org/aircraft/article...om-garmin.html

[Luds02m]

Bugs - I'd be interested in reading your pirep! I have a Aera 500 that I would like to add weather information too.

[Bugs66]

Hey Folks, I received the GDL 39 today and took to my hangar to install. First impression is that the GDL 39 does exactly what it is designed to do and does it very well. I took it out for a quick spin tonight. The WX tonight was near perfect, clear and calm. Not the best scenario for testing all the features. Also the sky was empty of planes, so didn't get to test the traffic yet. I expect to continue reporting here my experience with it.

First, here is the unboxing and what you receive. When you order the GDL 39, specify what device you connect to and the cable is included. Mine was for the Garmin Aera 500 series.
WP_000432.jpg
I included my Aera 510 in the photo so you can judge the size of the GDL 39. The cable is similar to most other Aera cables, except the serial connector (data in/out) is prewired for the GDL 39. I realized this meant I would not have a GPS data-out connection anymore for my fuel flow gauge. My fuel flow gauge will calculate MPG and required fuel to waypoint. So this is disconnected for now. In reality, I don't use those features much. I am not sure if there is a workaround for this. I wil check into it.

WP_000435.jpg
If you have an Aera 500 series, the firmware needs to be updated to 4.0 before the GDL will be detected. I did this on a previous night.
After I wired up my GDL 39 to the Aera and power, I turned on my master switch to provide power, the GPS booted up. At first nothing seemed to be different. I got a quick message about updating for new device, then it went away. I fumbled around with menus scratching my head a few times. I unplugged my XM weather antenna thinking this was conflicting. No joy. Then I went to Tools>Settings>Interface Setup to look at the data comm protocol. It was set to NMEA/IN/OUT for my fuel flow gauge. I changed the Serial Data Format to Garmin Data Transfer and Normal, then all of a sudden things started to happen. First the Aera updated either itself or the GDL or both, but as you see in the screen above I let it finish to 100%. After this was finished, I returned to menus and found all kinds of interesting new menus and choices.

WP_000436.jpg
I noticed that Map Setup has a FIS-B setup where you can turn on/off WX features on the map.

WP_000439.jpg
There is a Weather Setup menu from within the original Weather menu that lets you select between XM, FIS-B, or Auto. I noticed right away if I set to auto and the XM antenna was connected, the XM seemed to have priority and none of the FIS-B weather features display in the Weather menu. I set to FIS-B and they show up and stick. I am not sure how the FIS-B and XM are supposed to play together so will need to do some learning. That is if I keep XM. Just from tonight, I am already thinking about cancelling the XM.

WP_000440.jpg
This is another new screen. Data Link where you enable the ADS-B air-to-air traffic. Since this unit does not provide ADS-B OUT, I only get traffic info from other aircraft broadcasting OUT. I dont' get any of the ground based information on traffic, which will be needed for a complete ADS solution. I heard there is a way to hitchhike on another aircraft's ADS-B OUT communications and you essentially get the full traffic picture, however that only works if you are nearby one of these aircraft.

WP_000441.jpg
Photo of how I laid out the various devices on my dash. This worked very well for my flight tonight and was able to pick up 3 ground based stations as soon as I took off. I also had a weak signal for one tower while on the ground. The tower was around 30 miles away. This is going to be a really nice system when the FAA is finished installing all the towers.

More review coming in next post.

[Bugs66]

The information available from the GDL in flight was very interesting and somewhat exciting as a preview to what ADS-B will be for pilots in the coming years. The following are some screenshots I took tonight. Like I said before, it was a quiet night and took the opportunity to refresh my night currency while playing with the GDL.

729.jpg
I had previously set my weather setup to be FIS-B only, this way I could be sure those menu choices would show.
Notice the choices now available from FIS-B, which is quite a bit more than the XM Lite package.

874.jpg
Here is the Data Link "Information" screen from weather.

923.jpg
I couldn't resist trying Nexrad to see how it worked different from XM. Well I had to look around quite a bit but found some echos up in BC. Not much radar to look at, however I noticed one thing interesting. I switched over to XM and looked at the same area on radar. Nothing showed. This was disappointing and reminded me that the XM seems very slow to update their data.

2292.jpg
I switched back to FIS-B. I noticed there is a new choice to "Animate Weather". This was cool, and as expected the radar echos were animated and I could see their trend.

1075.jpg1091.jpg
WX data is translated same as XM however NOTAMS now available!

1739.jpg
FIS-B weather status page. I believe this is when last updated. Not exactly sure yet.

1418.jpg2813.jpg
You can also check on the ADS-B towers you are receiving. Above shows one west of Spokane, another near Coeur D'Alene, ID. Another showed up south not far from St. Maries.

1240.jpg
A shot of the new "Home" page with new icon "Traffic" where you can see all your targets on a radar like screen. Traffic will also be overlayed on the map, however tonight was not the night to test it because no airplanes were around.

Stayed tuned for more pireps in the next few days. So far I really like this thing. ADS is cool!

[mvivion]

Good information, Bugs, keep it coming, especially coverage, etc.

MTV

[spinner2]

Thanks Christian for a very well presented first report. I'll bet you had a nice night flight too with no clouds and lots of moonlight last night.

Does the FAA have a map showing where there are towers? I'm wondering how well this will work in the mountains at sub-ridge altitudes?

I got an update for my 560 last week from Garmin and now it won't see my xm antenna. Another 560 does see it. Garmin wo t respond.

[barbwire]

Very good pirep. I will follow for further updates but from what I have seen I will be purchasing one in the near future. I also have the aera 500 so this educational.----------thanks

[Bugs66]

Hey Dan, yes it was a beautiful night to fly. I too would like a map and a schedule of all the towers the FAA is installing. I haven't found one yet. Funny how these things are poping up all over and nobody seemed to pay much attention, until now

One thing interesting, when ADS-B takes off, makes me wonder what happens to the XM service. I think they will need to re-evaluate what they are charging. I might hang on to it for $10/mo for convenience, but forget the $35 or $50. Also interesting is there seems to be little value in buying any Aera 5xx higher than the 500 model now. No need to pay the surcharge for XM compatible device. Use the money savings for the cheaper unit and buy the GDL 39 with it.

[OVEREASYGUY]

Have any of you tried the garmin Pilot app for Iphone and/or Ipad with the Garmin GDL 39? does anyone know if the Garmin App has Track UP - that's the only thing I don't like about foreflight. And Foreflight does not support the GDL 39 - only the other one they sell which does not give traffic data.
cliff in Maine

[Bugs66]

New article by Garmin with tips for configuring GDL 39:
http://garmin.blogs.com/my_weblog/20...ur-device.html

Pireps coming in http://www.vansairforce.com/communit...ad.php?t=89540

[OVEREASYGUY]

Slowly learning to use my new GDL-39 fed to my Iphone with Garmin Pilot app. Pretty cool stuff! Had to buy a 1-2 cigarette lighter adapter and feed that into another one - so I now have 3 plugins - GPS, Iphone, & GDL-39. If these could all be feed from USB plugs that would be great! I taped things all up and so my wires are now all organized. I wish I had my new $900 Ipad. My girlfriend got mad at me (because I wont buy her a ring, marry her, and bankroll a nail salon for her) and threw it in the trash! I never even got to try it out in my airplane! Dam! I think I know what I'll be getting from her for Christmas! Iphone screen is just a little too small for my liking!
Cliff Dow in Maine

[Luds02m]

Received my GDL-39 for my Aera 500 yesterday. The base unit has the bluetooth enabled so with the Aera cable I can connect to either the Aera 500 or iPad. FYI. It appears the uplink is only connected after I get in the air. I thought I would be able to receive weather updates on the ground before takeoff with the unit. I'll have to read more information on ADS-B technology.

Dave

[Bugs66]

Did you get the free battery and carry case for it? That offer expires the end of the month.

[Bugs66]

Garmin released updated S/W for both Aera 5xx and GDL39:
http://www8.garmin.com/support/downl...ls.jsp?id=4683

[GeorgeMandes]

I am in a tent in Circle City, waiting on wx, on the way home from the Brooks Range. Have the 39 hooked up to an iPad, and partially to a 396 (I say partially as it doesn't work right, and I assumed need a software update I didn't have time to look for before leaving). If XM worked in Alaska, I wouldn't see this as a replacement. Seems like my wife can get wx thru her AT&T iPhone as often as I have been getting ADS-B weather. I am flying a 185, but it still isn't easy to fly and manipulate an iPad in demanding flying conditions. The certified product hooked to a G500 might be different. So far the 39 is interesting, but no game changer.