" and other needed aviation infrastructure"...................while we are losing airports too!! this is getting bad..........
I hope they plan on selling them to the Chinese. I know the airplane market is tough right now but so is every market. It doesn't get any better with all of our Amreican companies taking the employment overseas. Who does Cessna think is going to buy their airplanes when they themselves are another company adding to the list of unemployed Americans? Very sad. One would think that Cessna could get more inovative than to just move over seas. Another great American company down the tubes in my book. I have no desire to even sit in a Skycatcher. I'd much rather fly the little Cessna 150 or any other of the fine Cessna products that were built right here.
What's more is try getting new parts from Cessna for anything built after 1998 in a couple years.
"the industry is increasingly dependent on emerging markets"...
I think they are being nice in saying "sweat shop labor" for pennies an hour.
ONE must admit that the unions have made it pretty hard to be building discretionary income toys... people are having a hard time, and the unions around here all want a raise...
But the move is just another nail in the coffin for GA I bet...
I don't know where you've been me lad, but I see you won first Prize!
I suspect Cessna's market potential in China exceeds the American one that's already peaked, at least in the forseeable future. It's hard to discredit Cessna as a model of a business survivor. They've seen the hardest of times and they still make great products and pay stockholder dividends, and that's the name of the game. Best of luck, I say.
I wonder when Textron will move Lycoming over there? I'm surprised they haven't done so already.
SB,
while I will not argue your points as correct, I will add that the machinery that comes out of China is NOT the same quality as from the US; specificly the steel is not as strong and wears much faster.
If the aluminum alloy and heat treatment have the same quality control I have seen on other stuff from there, it will be bad news. My opinion.
I don't know where you've been me lad, but I see you won first Prize!
I think you're right about the sweatshop labour issue. Now lets see if the prices go down. Probably not too many of those workers ever likely to buy anything new let alone any kind of a Cessna. There have been a few wage earner union types here save enough to buy an old airplane of some sort. Sometimes these are the people buying the discretionary income items that make life here, well....better. Things that some of us make or do that makes it possible for us to cub around a bit. And you have to wonder how accepting the government of China would be of general aviation as we know it. If at all.
I have been at a HP Digital Printing conference this week in D.C. Yesterday, the VP of the Indigo division spoke about the growth in China and India and the efforts the Chinese particularly are making to change not just the perspective but also the reality of low labor costs. Most of the HP products we were discussing this week are manufactured at the Indigo plant in Israel, but they are doing some stuff in China more and more - as it is a huge consumer of their print products also.
The main thing he pointed out was disappointing about his many trips to China, is that when you look out the window or go outside, the smog is always there. Apparently, this is something else they are finally starting to address.
He also pointed out that even during the worst part of the US recession, the world economy was growing at the rate of 4% per year.
These countries are not just manufacturing stuff for us anymore, they are consuming it at a much faster rate than we are.
sj
"Often Mistaken, but Never in Doubt"
------------------------------------------
I was in China about five years ago and there might have been one day you could have flown VFR. A military jet flew overhead many times and the only way I knew he was there was the sound. I did get a glimps once and he was very low. I was in the Shanghai area.
Ron
All you have to do is look at the price of the Cessna Skycatcher and compare it to airplanes still made here. Did you see a huge drop in price when Levi's moved overseas and used super cheap labor force and now use denim that lasts months instead of years. There are no discounts from the labor savings of moving overseas.
I was a Union carpenter for many years and dropped out. For years, they provided me with good wages, good medical insurance, and a retirement that I could actually retire on. In return I provided them an excellent and qualified worker that did the best I could do and took pride in what I did. I dropped out when they started becoming all about the union and not about producing and providing that quality workforce anymore. But pride in the workforce is gone, not just union, but non-union also. The company I work for now is your typical big business nightmare where the managers and the labor force are so far apart and do whatever it takes to make each other look bad. No cooperation at all, no incentives at all, no pride at all. It's just a paycheck. Very sad actually.
With CEO's making millions and millions you would think they would be intellingent enough, care enough, be creative enough, to provide incentives for the working class, and pull the labor force and management together to create an inovative company that sets the standards for all others to follow. But no, most CEO's only care about themselves also and jump to whatever company that's going to add another million to their paycheck. It's difficult to keep a smile, work hard, and do your best for a company when you just got turned down for a quarter on the hour raise and the CEO that did that, makes more in a day than you make all year. Actually, that's not to far off from the way the China labor operates.
But then again, the CEO isn't paid to make good business decisions anymore. He is paid to keep stockholders happy. So a CEO will make horrible long term business decisions as long as it keeps short term stock earnings up. However, after several years of those poor decisions and meager stock earnings, then they have to move to China to keep stockholders happy because the business itself has failed miserabily and then they blame the high costs of labor here in the US as the reason of failure. Yea right.
Actually, Cessna is just a division of Textron. I don't know if you have tried to buy a Cessna part in the last year but their prices on parts seemed to have about tripled in the past couple of years. I'm sure they can make lots of $$ if they can sell parts for that price. A friend of mine makes some components for Cessna and they have him backed up 6 mos. right now.Originally Posted by sierra bravo
I find it hard to believe that they are going to move the jet production to China when we are seeing a lot of re-shoring today.
Tim
Piper J-5A C-90 N40877
J-5 Project Pictures
I guess that is ok if you are looking for short term profits but there is a lot more at stake than money. Once you send manufacturing technology over to China there is a very good chance that in the near future there will be a competitor using your technology.
Piper J-5A C-90 N40877
J-5 Project Pictures
Thanks for the lessons in business and industry.
And just think, if things continue like they are, China will probably own the fields I'm planting.
Errrr.....ummmmmm....that's called business 101. Managements job is to make money for the owners - the stockholders. It is NOT their job to make a comfy work place or provide the best product on the market at the cheapest price - tho we can all agree these things do help from our perspective. Good labour relations reduces labour issues and a quality product is good for sales. Both affect the bottom line - and the bottom line is what drives everything.
Having lived and flown professionally in Asia and knowing the emerging market, I suspect what Cessna is talking about is setting up secondary production lines to feed the Chinese/Asian market. IF at some point in the future that product is good enough quality to meet wants elsewhere, it will be sold elsewhere. We are all quick to bitch about the FAA on here, but they will have to approve the quality before it can be certified over here.
The Chinese (or any other country you can name) are capable of making products that meet our standards of quality. The unfortunate problem is that WE don't demand it i.e. we continue to accept and purchase inferior products because of the price (who's with me on Harbour Freight?). It's why the majority of us shop at WalMart and not Neiman Marcus. If we didn't buy the crap, they wouldn't make it.
John Scott
While I respect the folks that use Cubs to make a living, my uses are for recreation and leisure - AND I'M NOT ASHAMED!!!
That assessment is consistent with the Cessna press release.
http://www.cessna.com/NewReleases/Fe...384202959.html
Um, if I'm not mistaken, a significant amount of Cessna assemblies and parts are currently manufactured in Mexico.
MTV
Didn't this all start with pistons made in Brazil? I'm pretty sure when I overhauled my O 235 in the mid 80's, the pistons came from down there.
Nope,
it started with stuff made in Canada aye!
I don't know where you've been me lad, but I see you won first Prize!
I think De Havilland built a few aircraft in Canada. Some bush utility sort of stuff that is actually still being used. Now go to the store and buy a razor. Get the clerk to unlock the display for you as most places have them locked up now that the manufacturers moved production offshore and you don't buy them with pocket change any more. Obviouly no saving there to moving production offshore, at least to the consumer anyway. Maybe airplane parts will be different. Maybe a Cessna doorpin won't cost $22.00 anymore, might be $35.00.
Should have said razor blades.
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