I just bought a 180 in Palmer with a corroded O470J engine. I am building up a O470R engine to put in it. I am planning on putting new ECI cylinders on it. Does anyone have an opinion on nickel or steel? I am leaning torward the steel ones beacause of cost.
If you plan on flying quite often then steel is fine, if it will sit a lot go nickel.
Sent from my HTC Evo using Tapatalk
I like the nickel ECI's that I have on my 470K.
I have been using the nickel because of corrosion issues when airplanes aren't flown regularly. Was at Gibson Aviation recently who have been in the cylinder business for two generations. They are starting to see the ECI nickel cylinders come in for their first overhaul and find the barrels measuring out to new dimensions.
Steve Pierce
"When everything seems to be going against you, remember that the airplane takes off against the wind, not with it."
Henry Ford
Thanks everyone! I'll probably go nickel.
I actually bought a factory reman O470R! I put all the Alaska bling on it. Atlee Dodge mount and heat shields, Leading Edge exhaust, firewall battery, new seaplane prop.
011.jpg
Very cool. Enjoy!
I saw a friend's plane in for maintenance a few days ago. New ECI cylinders.... Again. With these he's up to 30 cylinders as he approaches the end of his TS 0-520's first run. OUCH!
SB
Last edited by StewartB; 09-14-2011 at 10:24 PM.
StewartOriginally Posted by StewartB
My 0550F/TS has 2300SMOH (2500TBO) and 450STOH by Lycon. Comp all in 70's and oil analysis is good. Guess I should keep my fingers crossed!
Lou
My friend's newest cylinders have been tuned up by Lycon. He says they'll do his next motor, too. I've heard nothing but good about them.
SB
I used ECI cylinders on SJ's C180 on Steve Knopp's rave reviews and my own experience. Do you know what sort of problems your friend has been having Stewart?
Steve Pierce
"When everything seems to be going against you, remember that the airplane takes off against the wind, not with it."
Henry Ford
Cracks. They found 5 cracked at last week's hundred hour inspection. All was well at 300 hours and 5 bad at 400 hours.
Don't take me wrong. I'm not bashing ECI. I've got their cylinders on my -12. I've never heard of anyone else having trouble like his. It's alarming.
SB
Last edited by StewartB; 09-15-2011 at 08:08 AM.
Could it be operating procedure?I've never heard of anyone else having trouble like his
My impression is no. He's only had problems with this engine. I'd like to believe the cylinders are a symptom and not the problem. That would make me feel better about my own ECIs. I can't speak for all 0-520 owners but my own has struggled with fuel so that's the thing that comes to my mind. Its hard to get enough fuel to these big motors. My carb's been off a few times. I can't imagine my friend's mechanics wouldn't have looked at that, too, but there's only so much we can do. I still like my 0-520 but my next motor will have injectors.
SB
I have a bit of time flying and working on an O520 in a 180. It's carb has been off a few times as well! I don't know if Pponk did enough engineering on the fuel flow. It's one of the reasons I went with an O470. I put Dane's exhaust on it and I am trying to keep it light. Toying with the idea of installing wing extensions.
Last edited by Charlie Longley; 09-15-2011 at 10:47 AM. Reason: typo
With the 0-470-50 engine, did you guys use PPonks carb? Steve does work on his that others do not. Kenmore's 0-470 conversion uses a different carb than Steve's. My 470-50 went to TBO with nary a problem.
Jim
Pponk did my carb but the "problem" started before that. My last factory reman 0-470 came with a brand new Precision carb. It ran dangerously lean. TCM paid to have it modified to improve fuel flow. They got it better enough to categorize as lean enough to be concerned but airworthy. About 100 hours later my crank was condemned and I did the Pponk mod. Steve Knopp did the carb while BJ did the engine work. Once together it was too lean. We dealt with it and once again got it to an acceptable level but still on the lean side. A couple of years ago I had an engine fire and subsequently had the carb rebuilt. The shop recognized the carb hadn't been re-worked to comply with a Pponk service letter that directed the carbs to be modified to provide more fuel. They did the work. Since then my carb has been pretty good and I can control my mixture like I want. My friend's airplane has a Texas Skyways engine. I have no idea what they do for carbs or whether his has been examined. Knowing his mechanic I suspect it has.
SB
SJ's carb had to be sent to a carburetor shop to comply with the P-Ponk STC. I spent hours on the phone with Steve Knopp learning his little tricks for better fuel distribution, cooling etc. I think it all paid off because SJ will randomly send me a text/email picture of his engine monitor with everything lined up like an injected engine. Kinda cool to see it running smooth and cool.I used a different balance tube, surfaced all the intake tubes to line up perfectly and modified the Airforms baffles slightly per Knopp's recommendations. I also had Barrett Performance balance all the reciprocating parts. With the new prop she is very smooth. Just got done with the annual with less than 200 hrs. on her the compressions were all high 70s and everything else looked good.
Steve Pierce
"When everything seems to be going against you, remember that the airplane takes off against the wind, not with it."
Henry Ford
So Steve K let you in on the secrets?I spent hours on the phone with Steve Knopp learning his little tricks for better fuel distribution, cooling etc. I think it all paid offThe engine shop in Omaha told me they wanted to get on with him but couldn't and they have have all kinds of machine work capabilities.
Pireps, please! I considered Dane's exhaust but went with an Acorn instead. I've never talked to a 180 owner that has a LEE installed. Lots of friends have Wing X. All love it. I've considered it but really don't need it. A friend just added extensions, VGs, and Sportsman cuff. He's grinning.
SB
Jack Johnson at Texas Skyways modifies all the carbs that go on the 0550F/TS. Similar I am sure to what Steve K does. Mine flows 28-30gph on T/O full rich. Even leaning to 1200-1250F EGT in climb (avg 22GPH), I never see CHT's above 380F. That's with cowl flaps full open. In cruise I burn avg of 15.0GPH (2330/FT, 153KTAS) and CHT's are 360-370 even in ISA+20 conditions. It has huge jets I am sure, as I need to lean aggressively on the ground, no matter the OAT or DA.
Now if I could just fly it as well as I do my Cub
Lou
Good info, Lou. Thanks for sharing it. Man, that's a lot of fuel for take-off. I'm glad I don't have a fuel instrument! I have no idea what my fuel flow is but my hot cylinder CHTs run 375-380. It gets the job done. I lean on the ground since the last carb work. That's a nice change.
FWIW, the -12 runs CHT at 375 as well. And I have to tape the coolers on both planes year round to get 180* oil temps. I should start a temperature poll. It would be interesting to see what everyone's planes are running for CHT and oil temps.
SB
Last edited by StewartB; 09-15-2011 at 07:55 PM.
Stewart....My Cub(0360 hot rodded 200+HP) flows 18.5 GPH at full throttle/full rich on T/O. EGT's range from 1080 to 1200 on T/O. Usually lean to 13.5GPH for climb...gets me 1200-1300 on EGT's. CHT rarely goes over 390-410 in a long climb, even at high oat. Cruise CHT's are 10-15F higher with the dual P-mags then with Slicks (39 vs 25 deg of advance). That gives me 350 coolest and 385-390 hottest CHT burning 7.2 GPH at 2480. Prop is a 1P-235 8443. TAS is 98-100 at all altitudes up to 9500msl with that setting. Weight doesn't seem to matter.....2300# or 1500#...performance is the same.
TMI
Lou
I'll let you know how the LEE works out. I haven't flown the airplane yet. I am going back up to BJ's to pick it up at the end of the month. I think I did the first STC on pre 1955 180 exhaust! I will probably do the wing extensions for the higher gross weight. I don't like the cuffs for flying on skis.
Charlie
Gotta ask. What don't you like about cuffs w/ skis?
SB
They've caused accidents on skis! The wing will fly at a speed below aileron effectiveness basically burying a ski causing a wreck. I've flown cuffed and straight wings on 180's and 185's. I haven't flown a cuffed wing with VG's though it may re-energize the ailerons.
Charlie
Interesting. I've never heard that. Is that true of other lift enhancements? How will wing extensions differ?
SB
I am not sure! Read Wager with the Wind: The Don Sheldon Story. There is a pretty good story in there where he blames a cuffed wing for one of his ski-plane accidents. I have a theory if you put VG's on a cuffed wing it would help the ailerons work at a lower speed. My hangar mates 180 has a cuffed wing we're thinking about putting VG's on.
I really like the Hoerner style Metcoaire wingtips! A lot of bang for your buck!
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote
Bookmarks