Stewart posted: "There is NO browse problem."
I heard the same sort of thing from "ranchers" on Kodiak who put their cows out in belly deep grass, and couldn't understand why they were starving to death with a full rumen.
Stewart--Caribou are heavily dependant on lichens for their nutritional requirements. You could have grass that's waist high, and it doesn't provide any information at all regarding caribou forage. How'd the lichen crop out there look to you?
MTV
Mike,
Since the bushes, then grasses, then mossberries, and finally lichens all grow in different areas apparently depending on age of the cinder flows and topographical variations, I'd say the lichens are thriving just like all the other vegetation. There certainly is no difficulty finding lichens. Coincidentally the harder ground that best suits the lichens is also the easiest ground for the wolves to do their business, particularly since the flows sit in depressions relative to the surrounding terrain. It's certainly the easiest terrain to find caribou remains. But then, bears can't bury stolen caribou on the flows, either. I'm sure if a guy was motivated to find caribou remains in the grass and berry fields he could do so, but most of us prefer to walk the firmer ground. If you want to go now I can show you a kill site in the vegetation. You'd never spot it from the air, either. That raises the question of how accurate any aerial predator kill surveys could be. If your intention is to infer that there's a feed problem and that the animals aren't healthy? Based upon the animal I saw field dressed and helped carry the 6 miles back to camp? We trimmed quite a lot of fat from the quarters to save whatever weight we could. That animal wasn't a monster in body size but he sure wasn't low on body fat. I had stated previously that I passed on taking an animal. My hunting partner did not.
For the rest of you, here's a shot of typical Unimak topography and vegetation, including the smoking volcano in the distance.
Stewart
Dave, Your comments are 100% right on the money! Unfortunately, the wolf lovers missed the facts when they passed the first two initiatives banning land & shoot. Thanks to them and our former Governor, Tony, we have huge areas with no ungulates or wolves present do to a total population crash in the ecosystem. In the late 80's and early 90's we enjoyed the same areas with healthy moose and wolf populations. There was even plenty left over for the bears. That's game mismanagement taken to it's highest level!!! Now that their 3rd attempt to ban our predator control has failed, we should be reducing wolves in other areas of the state before they eat themselves out of house & home.
Good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of
that comes from bad judgment. will rodgers
"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb deciding what to have for dinner. Liberty is a well-armed lamb." Ben Franklin
Look at the improvement in calf survival rates! Too bad the feds are screwing the pooch on Unimak while the state is making a difference on the mainland. The article is a little too left for me but the calf survival rate is hard to dispute.
http://www.adn.com/wildlife/story/586116.html
Stewart
Um, Stewart--most of the southern Peninsula is also federally owned....
MTV
The wolf control effort in the story was conducted by ADFG. They got more than 28, according to my friends who were there. Action achieved results. Bravo. As far as I can tell the feds are doing nothing to control predators on federally managed lands in south west Alaska. Well, that may not be true. Was it the feds who just eradicated all the Norway Rats on Rat Island? Not a priority in my life, but it sounds like their efforts were well planned and the results were impressive. I wonder if the east coast greenies will raise hell over the slaughter of those poor rats!
Stewart
"Slaughter" of the 'regal' Norway Rat?
If rats looked like "mans best friend", it might make the national media.
We have to face it> Wolves are cool! Wolves have style! Wolves have just as much right to those caribou and moo................wait a minute. I went a little far on that.D
Hey, guys, the US Fish and Wildlife eradicated (yes--that is PRECISELY the terminology they used) the red fox from several Aleutian Islands a few years back. Foxes--as in cute little fuzzy guys--sorta miniature wolves, like.
And, you never heard a whimper from the antis, or from the media.
That's cause they did it with full disclosure, and with a well documented goal in mind, re-establishment of the Aleutian Canada goose, as well as strictly defined limits, with measurable objectives.
If the feds ran this wolf "reduction" program, it wouldn't raise a stink...
My point, Stewart, was that for the State to conduct a wolf reduction program on federal lands, they must have the permission of the federal land manager. Otherwise, they'd get a ticket.....
MTV
Darn,
We almost had the pull in DC for Alaskan Managers to TELL the feds that is what we are doing...
Foxes and rats: both introduced, so not natural. Was easy to justify a non natural critter extermination. (I know a guy that helped on the foxes, said they left baited traps all over in case they missed any also).
Can we live trap some wolves and turn them loose in nantuckett and Martha's vinyard. Solve their deer problem and our wolf problems
I don't know where you've been me lad, but I see you won first Prize!
Live around wolves for a while and be in a business that requires animals to make your living... The wolf will lose some luster!
We need some. The balance is a great thing. We affect the balance.
We all agree to this point as I can see.
When we take a large number of the prey in a year, and a very small number of wolves AND BEARS, we lose a balance quickly.
With all the other factors working against the moose and caribou, (people building their houses in winter forage, freeways etc like california and other states) it is a much more simple task to work on the wolves than wait for the aformentioned 20-30 years for the balance to become righted.
SO: our stomaches do the talking. I don't hunt trophy, I like to fill my freezer. It makes my hunting harder when the law says "shoot only 50" moose. I want the 25" tender one, but then I pay a big fine and lose the meat.
When I was younger we took as many as 100 moose out of the valley that we now take 25. Back then the loggers shot every bear and wolf seen. We still have fewer moose than 25 25 years ago...
I don't know where you've been me lad, but I see you won first Prize!
Here's a picture of my hunting partner posing with a typical Unimak caribou. We saw several just like this one.
Stewart
aktango wrote: "Foxes and rats: both introduced, so not natural. Was easy to justify a non natural critter extermination. (I know a guy that helped on the foxes, said they left baited traps all over in case they missed any also). "
REALLY????? Ever hear of Wild Horse Annie???? Wild horses and burros have pretty much been the downfall of the Desert Bighorn sheep, and some other small populations of bignorn sheep. While the horses and burros are clearly "introduced species", early efforts at eradication turned into bloody routs by PETA and the wild horse (e's asses), and the abominations on the land remain today.
I can recall aerial horse and burro hunting. Don't try that nowadays, by the way.
It's called politics, and the one with the best PR program gets the job done.
ADF&G and the Alaska Board of Game has one of the worst PR programs going. Sorry, but that's just a fact.
Before you Alaskans flame me, I would respectfully point out that there has been at least one and maybe two statewide referenda which said NO MORE aerial hunting of wolves, except under extreme circumstances, but the BOG and ADF&G have always found a means to continue the hunt, one way or another.
THAT is not good PR, and if you don't get your PR stuff together, it makes no difference whatsoever what sort of scientific evidence you have to back up your assertions.
Stewart, I have bad news for you: Caribou populations cycle. They always have, and they always will. You may recall not that many years ago, when certain radio stations used to broadcast where the caribou were crossing the Glenn Highway, so people would go out and intercept them. Might as well kill as many as you can while they peak, cause they are GOING to crash, and soon.
Again, I have no issue with killing wolves. I think every trapper in Alaska should get off his or her keester and go kill a few. I also have no big problem with aerial wolf hunts, as long as there's a reasonable justification for doing so. That really isn't the case on the southern peninsula or certainly not on Unimak.
There is no human use on Unimak to speak of, except wealthy folks who'd save a LOT of money by purchasing top sirloin in Anchorage.
It's the last of the really natural places. Leave it alone. I'm not talking about other parts of the state, necessarily, but certainly Unimak. Go spend some TIME there, as opposed to a couple days. Learn to appreciate that fantastic part of the world. And try not being offended that an animal can actually kill a large carnivore with it's teeth fer cryin out loud. Actually, it's pretty amazing, if you really think about it. And, Unimak is one of the last of the truly wild places, unlike most of the rest of Alaska.
My opinion, and we all know what that's worth, thank you very much.
MTV
Let's see. 15,000 Alaska Airline miles for the PenAir ticket to beautiful Cold Bay and a buddy flew me over to Unimak for nothing. Not a nickel changed hands. I guess if you live in Minnesota and want to do the trip you may need to be wealthy. It's just over yonder for me. No big deal. I was there in September/October. I have plans to return in July and this time my hunting buddy and I are taking the wives, too. How about you, Mike? Will I see you there? Maybe I'll just miss you?
Animal populations have cycles. I accept that. The State of Alaska's constitution requires fish and game resources be managed for a sustainable yield. Humans have the capability to do that. That's the point of "game management". My State is doing it as the article I linked indicated. Unimak is federally managed and will, at least in the short term, continue to showcase the merits of doing nothing. My posts about the area are simply an attempt to give some open minded individuals here a more personal perspective than the one they're rationed by the media. I wouldn't expect them to know the real deal any more than I'd expect you to.
Stewart
MTV,
Where to start........
I believe it is much easier to eradicate 'RATS', with the threat of disease, than any animal that can be thought of as pets; and little girls like their horses!
Foxes, that got the PR of all the shore bird destruction, so the Greenpeace and that type got on board, PR Like you say.
My statement was not to say that all non-natural critters can be eradicated, but they have been successful in the past getting to do it.
I find you correct in many of your statements about Alaska PR, we as a group do get tired of outside influence, and tend to ignore it to our detriment.
If we really want to get into non-native, Pheseants were introduced also, so I am a hypocrite also, I admit.
The state did vote for wolf/predator control, (notice I said control not hunt) on the last ballot go around. So now we just have to get the outsiders to go away and let us do it.
I am not trying to "flame you" in any way. I respect what you have said, and agree with most.
Can we just open hunting for PETA and solve many problems?
I don't know where you've been me lad, but I see you won first Prize!
Now we're cookin....Let's turn loose 51 % of PETA membership, onto Unimak Island.
Then we'll turn Stewart loose on em....
Problems solved.
MTV
Hey MTV, read this. It seems the State sees it like I described.
My buddy Greg and I were the last caribou hunters on Unimak. Sadly that may hold true for a very long time.
http://www.ktuu.com/Global/story.asp?S=12519094
Your federal government at work........doing nothing. What a bunch of buffoons. These guys can make excuses for their lack of action for years. In fact that's what they're good at. They'd have you believe this wolf problem comes as a surprise to them. Believe me, they've known about it for a long time.
http://www.adn.com/2010/05/30/130109...de-refuge.html
SB
Stewart,
There goes that PR thing I was talking about.
The state doesn't have the legal authority to go anywhere it wants within the state's boundaries and kill stuff. I hope cooler heads prevail, but the recent hiring of a singularly unqualified ADF&G Director (who happens to have been a federal predator control agent) seems to suggest otherwise. ADF&G just LOVES sticking a finger in the eye of the feds in any case, any time they get a shot.
Note in the article that they reference the dissappearance of caribou on Unimak that I referred to earlier. Seems that the caribou came back from that one somehow, without aerial predator control. Wonder how they managed that on their own?
The state is saying they have all the answers as to what's going on with the caribou on Unimak, and it's all about wolves. Really?? I doubt if ADF&G has spent more than a few hours out there on that island in the recent (or distant) past. I seriously doubt if ANYone has done any research or investigations on those caribou or wolves.
And, just as ADF&G found out in the interior, it turns out that it's actually bears that are killing a LOT of these animals. So, how about aerial hunting on brown bears on Unimak, just to make sure? There's a lot of those things out there on Unimak.
After all, there are literally THOUSANDS of hunters just waiting to go hunt caribou on Unimak Island these days, so the state should spend tens of thousands of dollars to go out there and kill seven wolves? Give me a break.
Stewart, this isn't about caribou, and it's not about wolves. It is merely ADF&G taking another poke at the Fish and Wildlife Service, and the federal government in general. And, an extension of a history of very unprofessional behaviour.
Too bad.
MTV
Mike,
It's been two years since my first comments about Unimak. I've been back in the area since. Your comments were wrong two years ago. You're still wrong. Get off your bar stool and go see modern day Unimak for yourself before you comment. You'd look less foolish to those who HAVE been there and seen for themselves. Your statements are asinine.
SB
After the wolf introduction into the Rocky Mtn States, I have no use for anyone who worked or works for U.S. Fish and Wildlife in any capacity other than migratory fish management. Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation position on the wolf introduction is that <Canadian gray wolf introduction is one of the worst wildlife management disasters since the killing of the Buffalo in the 19th Century>. Check it out on their website under news releases.
The Wolf has had a much worse impact on Elk populations than expected here in Idaho. If steps are not taken, big game hunting will be a thing of the past in the not too distant future...
U.S. Government wildlife management needs to stay in DC and manage wildlife on the Capital Mall.
I'm one of those wackos who subscribe to the Darwin theory.Originally Posted by mvivion
As you said earlier, everything happens in cycles.
Cycle: Wolves kill MOST of their prey, and then they starve or move on, then the prey "come back" on their own (due to unprotected sex, I reckon) but it takes a LOOONG time, which is unacceptable to the humans who want to harvest them too.
Humans like everything to stay the same all the time... like jobs, weather, price of gas, etc. We don't like to eat nuts & berries when the meat is not available.
The people who think they can "manage" nature better than Ma Nature are just kidding themselves, however we can modify some things (like predator populations) to serve our needs/wants in the form of a more balanced cycle.
We are in direct competition (in some places) with predators. We could win the war & exterminate 'em, but our "live & let live good nature" dictates that we just keep things balanced a bit. Kinda like watering the plants we like, and spraying the ones we don't.
I also agree wholeheartedly with "locals" managing their own business, not some "shirt" at a distance telling us how things should be.
Nimpo Lake Logan... boonie SuperCubber
200mi (300km) from nearest stoplight... just right! - "Que hesitatus fornicatus est"
That is the RMEF's position today but it wasn't their position 15 years ago when the wolf was introduced. They took a neutral wait and see attitude when many professionals were saying this is a disaster in the making. The Canadians thought we were absolute fools. Fifteen years of hindsite proves the Canadians right and the RMEF as being too little too late. Many, including myself, dropped out of the RMEF because they were too spineless to take a stand against the wolf introduction.
The introduction of the wolf to the Northern Rocky's has been the worst thing to ever happen to big game populations in Montana, Idaho and Wyoming. And the bad news is they've spread to Oregon, Utah and Colorado now.
I haven't been to Unimak but I have been on the peninsula. We watched two wolves chase a prime bull caribou for a mile. He was able to keep ahead of them that long and then jumped into a lake with them nipping on his heels. The wolves skidded to a stop at the lake's edge while the caribou slowly swam to the far side. The two wolves watched him swim away for 20 minutes while we watched them at 200 yards. Oh how I wished for a wolf tag in my pocket. I had a rifle in my hands.
"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin
Stewart,
What part of what I posted is wrong? I merely stated what happened a number of years ago, which was pretty much verified by the article posted. I stated that the caribou population on Unimak literally disappeared over one winter. I was working out of Cold Bay at the time, and Unimak was part of the area I worked.
The rest of what I posted is simply a statement about the politics of the situation. The FWS has been repeatedly sued by protectionist groups when they have failed to conduct at least an EA on this very type of program (predator control). The current management is simply stating a fact: They can't permit predator control without doing at the very least an EA. That has come down from the courts, and there's no way around it. Since ADF&G doesn't own the land, they're not subject to those requirements.
I don't disagree that the Unimak caribou herd may be nearly gone. My only point was that it's happened before, and they've come back. Your statements suggest that they'll never come back, which is the typical sensationalism that ADF&G commonly puts out to the media.
So, you've camped and hunted on Unimak. Good for you. It is a beatiful place, and one of the most remarkable places I've ever visited and worked. I haven't been there for a long time, so I can't speak for what's going on out there now, with regard to animal populations. So, get over it--I'm not on a bar stool. I haven't suggested that your assessment of the current population is wrong, only that the past history of that population suggests a cyclical population. What you describe I witnessed myself in the mid to late 1970's. Then in the 90's, the population was booming.
As to the politics, this is one that's gone on since statehood, and you and I won't settle it.
I don't know anything about the Yellowstone wolf program. Wolves eat critters, though, so if you introduce them, they'll eat critters.
Don D,
It was the US Fish & Wildlife Service that eliminated the wolf in the Lower 48 many years ago. And it was them that did a LOT of wolf hunting in AK before statehood. I spent more than a few hours in the back of a SC shooting coyotes once upon a time, working for the agency.
Nowadays, however, ANYthing the government does is apt to draw the anti's legal reps out of the closet, and put a halt to nearly anything. Then the agency spends decades trying to get back to the job at hand: Management of the land and critters.
If you want a classic case, look at the case of the deer overpopulation on Great Swamp National Wildlife Refuge in NJ many years ago. FWS wanted to open a hunt on the deer. There were browse lines on ALL the trees, and no brush left, and the deer were obviously in bad shape. FWS put out a notice that they were going to open a special hunt on those deer.
One of the anti groups sued FWS, and shut down the hunt. Two years later, after spending a BUNCH of $$ on research to PROVE what was obvious to anyone--that there were too many deer for the habitat--the antis backed off and the hunt went forward.
Unfortunately, that routine is a fact of life for land managers these days. The antis will sue you if you do something and they'll sue you if you do nothing.
Bottom line, though--If the federal government DOESN'T do an EA on a predator control program on federal lands, they WILL be sued, especially if that predator is the wolf.
I have no beef with predator control programs that are well documented and backed by science. I don't see any problems with killing wolves, and if you're going to kill any animal, I'd sooner see them shot than trapped.
But, the anti's are still out there, and they have LOTS of well paid legal types, just waiting to file an injunction.
MTV
Like I said, go see it yourself. Let me know when you get back. I may consider your opinion more worthy and may take up the discussion with you. Until then? I have much better things to do.
Stewart
A new high court ruling concerning Alaska predator management.....
http://alaskadispatch.com/voices/med...tes-high-court
Stewart,
I thought you had better things to do...
A news flash: The Alaska Supreme Court has NO SAY whatever over what happens on federally owned lands.
I personally agree with this court's decision, frankly. But, on Unimak, there is a little problem: Who (humans, that is), precisely, are you managing the caribou for? There is one tiny village on Unimak, and frankly, they don't get out on the island much. And, as for folks like yourself, I'd bet you could count the number of caribou hunters who hunt Unimak in a year on the fingers of both hands.
So, that raises a couple questions:
1) is this the best place to spend many thousands of the State's precious wildlife managment dollars??
2) If indeed number 1) above is true, what's stopping ADF&G from conducting an EA for this purpose?? They know what the rules are on federal lands, and the AK Supreme Court doesn't take precedence over the US Supreme Court on the subject of environmental policy. So, what's the hold up?? In fact, there HAVE been EA's successfully implemented in Alaska on federal land. It can and has been done. Why doesn't ADF&G go through the process?
I suspect number 1 may be the answer to number 2. It would be hard to argue that it's wise to spend tens of thousands of dollars to kill seven wolves, so that a few rich folks could fly out there and hunt a caribou or two.
MTV
Nothing to do with Unimak. The feds will f that up like they're f'ing everything else in the country up. Actually, they already have. The federal management model is nothing to brag about from what I've seen. In this case I linked an important decision for a few Alaskans to read about. This is where we live. It matters to us.
SB
While not entirely in the same mode that all us infleunce is bad, I must say that at some point the agencies have to grow a pair, do the right thing and tell the courts to kiss off.
We as a people need to get rid of the judges that keep allowing these injunctions for any little thing
The court, when finding against the PETA folks, need to charge them a large sum of $$$$ to pay for the defendants attorny and court time; call it a penalty for their continued obstructions in people's lives...
And another thing...
The STATE owns the animals. They should do their job, and let the USFW folks give them a tresspass citation :P The state owns wildlife. We need less Kalifornia and Kenya managment...
Sorry MTV, far to many of the US employees take their job as an acting GOD position.
Seems that if the USFW would listen to locals, things would be easier... montana wolves are a prime example.
I don't know where you've been me lad, but I see you won first Prize!
Well, here we go on the state vs feds thing again. Whatever.
The point is that much of the land that Alaskans hunt, fish and recreate on is federally managed. The good news is that most of that land is still open to Alaskans and Outsiders to hunt, fish and recreate on.
Fortunately or unfortunately, depending on what camp you choose to park in, the court system and the legislature dictate a LOT of what happens on government owned land, whether it be state owned or federally owned.
But the point is, the rules are quite clear. If you want to conduct predator control on federal lands, an EA is going to be required. That wasn't a rule that was put in place by FWS. It was handed down by YOUR elected representatives in Congress. Believe you me, I didn't like that rule any better than many others in Alaska and elsewhere. Try working one of those deals when you're the guy who has to WRITE the dang thing.
Alaska is a great state, and I spent many great years there, for which I have many fond memories, and I am eternally grateful for the time I was able to spend in Alaska and the experiences I encountered there. I love the state dearly.
I hope that Alaskans and others are able to hunt and fish and recreate on federally owned land in Alaska for many years to come, just as folks do in this part of the world.
MTV
Well, here we go on the state vs feds thing again. Whatever.
The point is that much of the land that Alaskans hunt, fish and recreate on is federally managed. The good news is that most of that land is still open to Alaskans and Outsiders to hunt, fish and recreate on.
Fortunately or unfortunately, depending on what camp you choose to park in, the court system and the legislature dictate a LOT of what happens on government owned land, whether it be state owned or federally owned.
But the point is, the rules are quite clear. If you want to conduct predator control on federal lands, an EA is going to be required. That wasn't a rule that was put in place by FWS. It was handed down by YOUR elected representatives in Congress. Believe you me, I didn't like that rule any better than many others in Alaska and elsewhere. Try working one of those deals when you're the guy who has to WRITE the dang thing.
Alaska is a great state, and I spent many great years there, for which I have many fond memories, and I am eternally grateful for the time I was able to spend in Alaska and the experiences I encountered there. I love the state dearly.
I hope that Alaskans and others are able to hunt and fish and recreate on federally owned land in Alaska for many years to come, just as folks do in this part of the world.
MTV
MTV,
I think we do agree. You come from the 'been there done that', I come from the 'am tired of the BS'. Yes, it is a state vs fed, but really, it is an actual user vs idiots down south swayed by media...
I wonder how much of these that the elected from Alaska agreed with...
that idiot Knowles let the lawsuit goinstead of fighting the managment of fish and game...
Any chance you could take over as King for a day and get it strait? :P
I don't know where you've been me lad, but I see you won first Prize!
Judge Molloy in Missoula put the delisted wolf in Montana and Idaho back on the endangered species list two days ago. The environmentalists agrued that Wyoming wolves, that were still listed because they were considered vermin and US FWS didn't like that, couldn't be separated as a population from Montana and Idaho wolves. He ignored everything but that one point. And so now the good people of Montana and Idaho have lost their management tool - sport hunting of wolves - because of an activist federal judge in Missoula.
Federal judges are appointed for life. All we can do is not vote for the type of politicians that appoint people like Molloy. In my opinion and that of most 'normal' people is the feds need to stay out of the state's business. They create far more problems than they solve.
"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin
The federal government demonstrates on a daily basis that they have no concern for borders or boundaries. Your statement is a wise one.
Stewart
For once I agree with the Judge. Are they endangered or aren't they. Not including Wyoming on the delisting was wrong and F&W didn't like Wyomings way of doing things. Maybe now they will get their Arse in gear and delist them everywhere.
The most important aspect of this signature line is that you don't realize it doesn't say anything significant until you are done reading it & then it is too late to stop reading it....
Brian,, Buddy,,,,,,,,you been breathing way to much grasshopper spray! Wolves are Vermin when there are eating your pay check, Wyoming is the only state with the balls to stand up to the feds and manage them like we were all promised. They will most likely never win but at least they are fighting. Molloy is another example of a activist liberal judge legislating from the bench.
Word @ the Prairie County Fair today was they have been seeing wolves south of Terry and on B sheep Mtn.
Steve can you get those green loads in 00 ?
dave
You bet! I will put some in my pocket just in case..
Brian, You're thinking just like an activist judge now. If the question is are the wolves endangered the answer is no. All of the quotas on numbers of breeding pairs, distribution, etc. were met years ago. And those numbers have been far surpassed since then while the feds managed them. They aren't endangered. But what is becoming very endangered are the deer and elk herds the wovles are preying on while the environmentalists play lawyer games delaying the delisting. And their trump card is Molloy. He'll rubber stamp whatever they want.
For once I agree with the Judge. Are they endangered or aren't they. Not including Wyoming on the delisting was wrong and F&W didn't like Wyomings way of doing things. Maybe now they will get their Arse in gear and delist them everywhere.
Last winter, when wolves were under state control and could be shot if they were harrassing livestock, many were killed by ranchers. My neighbor killed two during calving season. Another neighbor had a horse attacked within 100 yards of their house. Now that wolves are listed again they'll have to call the feds who will show up in a day or two.
I agree with ag-pilot. Wolves are varmints - just like coyotes. Political borders don't change that.
"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin
delete
I had dinner with an old friend the other day whose father started a town on Lake Clark and he made a GREAT Point which he made to the Director of Parks in AK:
If the US F&WS, US Park Service, US Forest Service (ad nauseum) have in place and enforce policies that a) endanger the delicate balance of wildlife in their management areas, b) cause hunting to cease because of mis-management of wildlife and consequently lose the economic benefit locally and nationwide of those "rich people" hunting in those areas; c) continue to espouse liberal policies that affect the strength of the State and the Nation as a whole...
Then these Agencies in effect are NOT even fulfilling their own Promises and obligation to "Keep and Protect" these Parks and Federally managed lands "in Perpetuity"--That's FOREVER folks.
So do you think that China, or some other large Country will honor our Parks and Federal Lands when they take over our country because our Federal Government is broke, over-extended, and in-debt--to these VERY countries...and yet the polices continue to suck money into programs and useless EA studies that often were written solely to line the pockets of either politicians OR their constituents. I've a friend that is going for two weeks all over the state of Alaska, with 3 well paid Federal bioligists, in a chartered DeHavilland Beaver that will fly all over the State of Alaska spending thousands of Federal (borrowed) dollars on...a BUG SURVEY.
Think I'm way out there? The USA is borrowing 5 BILLION dollars A DAY, just to keep the wheels turning...borrowing from WHOM?
Clear and intentional mis-management of the wolf populations on a small insignifcant island in the Bering sea is a symptom of a much greater problem; and their obligation to see these lands continue "In Perpetuity" is becoming a quite unclear task.
We live here in Alaska as SB said, and of course, seeing lands being mis-managed by a screwed up mega-entity in DC hurts us where it hurts most--at Home.
RB
I've been ignoring this thread for a while. It pisses me off. The people who have their own opinions about this subject that really don't have a clue about it and for the most part does not affect them. The woods for me growing up was our Safeway. I'm an Alaskan native, born and raised in the bush. Been fortunate enough to grow up in the back of a cub. As a kid, I used to count moose going from one place to another (it was a fact of life, a given).It was the days of aireal wolf hunting. Today is another story, lucky to see a moose. I flew 250 miles today across interior Alaska. I seen 9 bears and about 8 (all cows) moose and 6 wolves. I know we can't kill and exterminate the wolves. They eat the dogs in our villages when they are hungry. They aren't dumb. Go try out the life before you knock it. You will, Guaranteed have a different perspective about it.
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