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Thread: Structural Ideas for hangar/home

  1. #1

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    Structural Ideas for hangar/home

    Any thoughts would help--

    What I know i want--hangar/home with 2 beds 1 bath upstairs 1 down-kitchen etc, in-floor heat, 8' 2 car garage door, hoist--

    Is a 50' door over kill or would a 16X40' door be just fine--i have an -18 but would like to be able to hold 3 planes i am thinking for buddies etc and resale

    looking to obviously maximize space and dollars--looking at something along the lines of a 50'x70' foot print

    Questions to answer: steel i think would be to expensive, i thought of using SIP's but not sure how to anchor them to hold in place and i don't want to have to bolt into the concrete slab--
    i have nearly enough 3x8x20 to build a 50x70'--i know it's overkill for a stick frame but if i have them and they didn't cost me anything why not look to use them?

    hopefully this isn't to vague---obviously i am in the early stages of dreaming but i know i want something that is big enough to suffice and not regret later by making it to small- not to sure on dimensions/materials-how high etc......

    i know bigger is better but $$ do play a role in my decisions

  2. #2

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    Hangar size

    Building codes (IBC) restrict hangars to a maximum of 2000 square feet, if attached to residential property. Standalone is no problem for size. That is why you see so many small hangar/home combo's.
    MOA definitely enforces this rule.
    I'm wishing for my own hangar too, but remain stymied due to similar problems.

  3. #3

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    Can't go wrong with the radiant in -floor heat! Have you thought of doing a hi-mass radiant floor with hot water solar panels?

  4. #4
    mccammon's Avatar
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    I just finished building a 50'x60' metal hangar in Colorado under the IBC and was restricted to 2000 sq. ft. due to the apartment. I ended up with a much larger apartment than I originally planned and was left with a 50' wide by 40' deep hangar, 45'x16' door. A super cub and Cessna live in there now, three planes would probably fit. The codes are really limiting when the hangar and home is combined. It is nice to have the planes just a door away but with the code hassles I would have built two separate structures if I was not at a county airport. I really like my house but have nothing positive to say about working under the constraints of the international building code.

  5. #5

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    Hangars

    I live in a fly in community TA50 in NM and my hangar is a 60WX70Deep
    with a 50ft 16H door I can fit a C-180, RV-6 and a C-172 all will fit at the half way mark +-(35) ft deep the rest is my shop that houses tools and parts
    if I had to do again I would go with a 60FT wide door the reason is when you want to fly either 180 or 172 you need to get them out both to get one out unless you park one slightly back and usualy that is the one you want to fly the RV-6 is allways in front so she gets out first but generaly I dont need to move her much to get the Cessnas out in, other words go for the bigger door you wont regret it!! on the question of desighn do no your codes but my neighbor built an awesome hangar home that housed a Staggerwing and his C180 and had 2 bedrooms and 2 baths and living area. and from his livingroom he could see his planes trough a glass wall.

  6. #6

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    Please clarify the IBC rules???

    My property on the big lake strip (residential land with an airport boundry crossing permit) has a 1 bed 1bath home on it now-- for ease of math lets say the hangar will be 50x50=2500sqft. what do they consider hangar space if say I come out 20ft and span the length for 1000sqft of living space upstairs-roughly 10ft above the hangar floor--underneath the living space it would be used as a boiler room, wash room and where a two car garage door would be--so the actual usable hangar space would be roughly 1500sqft due to the post/beams etc to support the upper structure??

    FYI, i am looking to build 18 foot high walls for the hangar with the living structure roof line raised up several feet to increase the ceiling height for the vehicles and have 9-10ft ceilings in the apartment...

    OR, does the apartment have to come all the way down to the ground level to stay within 2000sqft??

    Thanks for the info Gents....

  7. #7
    mccammon's Avatar
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    It all comes down to the local inspectors interpretation. The 1 hour fire separation between the hangar and living space was the challenge for me. I put in a 2x6 stud wall in with the two layers of 5/8" type x sheetrock floor to ceiling and then built off that with a rim joist on the inside for the second floor of the apartment. My local inspector is a moron so you might have more luck with the hangar/garage space. Another odd part of the code is that the building can not be over 20' high. I had to go a little shorter on the sidewall height so I could still have some pitch to the roof.

  8. #8
    375handh's Avatar
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    I'm not an expert but I was reading Section 412.3 - Residential aircraft hangars - of the IBC. A RESIDENTIAL AIRCRAFT HANGAR is defined as "An accessory building less than 2,000 square feet (186 m2) and 20 feet (6096 mm) in height, constructed on a one- or two-family residential property where aircraft are stored. Such use will be considered as a residential accessory use incidental to the dwelling."

    First, it would appear that if your property wasn't zoned residential, the whole issue might go away. The most obvious example of this would be building a hangar home on a hangar lot at a public airport.

    Second, the entire article dealing with residential hangars is kind of circular. Section 412.3.6 - Height and area limits - states: "Residential aircraft hangars shall not exceed 2,000 square feet (186 m2) in area and 20 feet (6096 mm) in height."

    So, all you have do do is build something bigger, and presto, it isn't a "residential aircraft hangar". Now, I know I probably wouldn't get away with this in the People's Republic of California, but I'm looking at building a hangar home in Idaho and I don't think this will be a problem.

    Thanks for bringing this one up.

    375HandH
    Ineptocracy - A system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers.

  9. #9
    Mark Lund's Avatar
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    Metal vs wood frame costs seem to vary with the area of the country you are in. A good quality all metal framed hangar was cheaper than a quality Morton wood frame in east Texas. That was one year ago. Steel prices have risen since than but it still might be worth checking.

    One draw back to an all metal framed building is that they are more expensive to adequately insulate.

    Mark

  10. #10

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    The way that IBC (International Building Code) works is that it sounds as if the code is allowing a small hanger to be considered an axillary structure to a residence. Like a separate workshop or garage in your back yard, IBC establishes it as the same risk. The size (square footage and height) limits are based on the fire potential and the risk that having a aircraft stored and worked on within close proximity to a residence creates to the residence... When you sleep and or have children in a portion of a structure you get more risk thus more protection.

    The second issue is if the local airport rules and or the zoning allow for dwellings, private can be easy but public is more of a challenge.

    Assuming you are allowed to build one and you are desiring to go larger and the code allows and the zoning is say commercial or IL (which is pretty common for commercial airports) you may still be be able to have a residential hanger but to build a large one may require additional protection to the residence portion in the way of greater fire and smoke separation. Maybe a one hour rated wall type X drywall on both sides of a stud wall, plus having it smoke sealed against the roof floor and side walls with no ventilation connections) between the two spaces with rated doors. These is not expensive construction but requires some care. Or if you are building separate structures locating them a minimum of 35' (I think that is the dimension) apart may be required.

    If the airport is zoned residential you may be able to go to the local board of adjustment (what they call them in Oklahoma) and request a hardship variance to get additional footage and or height. I can see where you might be successful if you needed more space to house your 3 planes or if one was large (say you get separation anxiety being at a different airport than your personal Citation and it just wont fit in 2000 sf) but if you are just looking to house your buddies plane or pick up a renter to help offset costs... unless you have an aviation minded BOA good luck.

    Another way might be to fire suppress (sprinkle) the structure. Currently about $3.50 a square foot around here provided you have a good water supply close by. Additionally, the insurance on a suppressed hanger would be likely significantly less that one that is not.

    Also you will have to pay attention to egress from the residence, if part of the same structure. With this I doubt a code official will allow access to the hanger to be considered one of the minimum of two egress routes from the residence (due to it being a greater fire risk) and if two story would likely require a rated stair going directly outside form the second story.

    IBC is a good code (and has a better support system for the local official if you have problems, and yes there are moron code folks out there just like there are moron pilots, so prepare yourself.) and is meant to be more universal from place to place than the various rendition of BOCA and other codes were. It also incorporates the Life Safety code directly rather than by reference but when you have a unique situation there is less room for interpretation by the official than older methods.

    Lastly allowing for a hanger as an ancillary structure may get an different interpretation than allowing for an hanger being directly attached to a dwelling and could be difficult if you don't have a fair code official especially if you want to get bigger than the code identifies.

    The largest suggestion I would make is to make an appointment with the local code official and just tell them what you are trying to accomplish. Avoid the spell of not telling them everything as if you think building per code is expensive you should try correcting to code.

    I know this is and has been done "everywhere" but if you are under the IBC you are playing my more stringent rules than elsewhere or those that other facilities were constructed under.

    I'm tired and had a glass or two this evening but I'll lake a look more at it on Monday and see what the IBC residential book says. If you want a specific idea looked at I'll try to help.

    Kirby
    What are we building a box or a watch?

  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Lund
    Metal vs wood frame costs seem to vary with the area of the country you are in. A good quality all metal framed hangar was cheaper than a quality Morton wood frame in east Texas. That was one year ago. Steel prices have risen since than but it still might be worth checking.

    One draw back to an all metal framed building is that they are more expensive to adequately insulate.

    Mark
    Metal buildings are up 15 - 22 percent from a year ago in the southern part of the country. At this point in construction inflation I would get a quote on a Morton and or look at a miracle truss or other weight saving steel designs.

    FYI - Asphalt went up 17% in the last two weeks and a year ago was running about $23 at the plant in Oklahoma. Today Type B Asphalt is running nearly $34 a ton at the plant and 5 years ago it was 18!
    What are we building a box or a watch?

  12. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by mccammon
    It all comes down to the local inspectors interpretation. The 1 hour fire separation between the hangar and living space was the challenge for me. I put in a 2x6 stud wall in with the two layers of 5/8" type x sheetrock floor to ceiling and then built off that with a rim joist on the inside for the second floor of the apartment. My local inspector is a moron so you might have more luck with the hangar/garage space. Another odd part of the code is that the building can not be over 20' high. I had to go a little shorter on the sidewall height so I could still have some pitch to the roof.
    How did Del Norte handle egress from your apartment?

    Did they allow you to have a mezzanine apartment or is yours ground floor or two story stacked? I ask this because I have seen one around here that is a mez. type construction and the underside is not fire rated and they got away with it and I am still amazed by it (airplanes parked under the sleeping area).
    What are we building a box or a watch?

  13. #13
    mccammon's Avatar
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    I have two man doors, one in the apartment and one in the hangar. I have so much glass in the apartment the inspector said that a second door in the Apt. was unnecessary. I was unable to get past the "accessory structure" issue with him and if there is a residence associated with the hangar in any way he is requiring the restrictions of the Residential Aircraft hangar section. I had already ordered the steel and had to put in a wall to the floor to meet the hangar size limitation. This was probably the easiest route for one guy to frame it anyway.

    My guess is that you will have more luck with your local inspector. As OldCrowe says there are all kinds. Unfortunately, I was the first person to pull a permit after our county adopted a code. After a series of lawsuits against a local contractor for building structurally deficient homes the county decided to adopt the IBC and hire that contractor as our inspector. His mother the county treasurer set his wage, etc., small town nepotism and corruption at its finest.

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