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avnxtek
07-10-2017, 05:06 PM
Let the fun begin
Got the kit home on July 1st A Javron wide body L-21 with a couple little mods
Just sorting everything out the first night


http://www.supercub.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=32039&stc=1&d=1499719878

http://www.supercub.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=32040&stc=1&d=1499719878

flylowslow
07-10-2017, 06:56 PM
Let the fun begin!:smile:

Lowrider
07-10-2017, 07:55 PM
Wow!! Congrats on the kit's arrival!

Every time I see one of these kits arrive I sorta wish I had bought a kit instead of just the plans...but then I've had a lot of fun and learned a lot with a plans build too. Best of luck!!

stewartb
07-11-2017, 08:19 AM
Let the work begin and the money flow! Fun stuff. Enjoy.

avnxtek
07-11-2017, 01:43 PM
Some progress
Overhead Trim installed, Interior panels ready for some type of covering mostly


32051

32052

32054

CuBob
07-12-2017, 07:15 PM
We're in Michigan are you located?

avnxtek
07-12-2017, 08:57 PM
We're in Michigan are you located?

C04. Oceana County

chinook
07-13-2017, 01:11 AM
I am also building about she same thing I am curious how your seat base fits in the frame,and I would test your fuel tanks with av gas for about a week the blue die finds the leaks I have now gotten three leaking tanks and one non leaky

skywagon8a
07-13-2017, 06:02 AM
I am also building about she same thing I am curious how your seat base fits in the frame,and I would test your fuel tanks with av gas for about a week the blue die finds the leaks I have now gotten three leaking tanks and one non leaky
I noticed your other posts on this subject and find this disturbing. Did you visually check ALL of the welded joints? What did they look like? A good visual check will often point out a potential leak location. Second, when you have a question you can pressurize the tank with a maximum of 3-5 psi air. Then with a soapy water solution brush over all the seams, look for minute air bubbles.

Frankly I'm shocked that you have three bad tanks from Javron. Where were your leaks located? In a weld or a threaded joint?

CuBob
07-13-2017, 07:41 AM
I am at KBIV. It would be fun to fly up and see your progress.

avnxtek
07-13-2017, 09:17 AM
I am also building about she same thing I am curious how your seat base fits in the frame,and I would test your fuel tanks with av gas for about a week the blue die finds the leaks I have now gotten three leaking tanks and one non leaky

Sorry about your issues Chinook.
Since I have only had my kit for 2 weeks now I haven't checked everything but I have mounted my seat base Whitehall fit perfectly well after trimming about .117 off the flap handle.
this is my first build so I really don't know what to expect but it is a Kit. I for one will fit check, trim, adjust, and repeat until I am happy.

i have worked on certified aircraft for like 30 years and I would say that this kit is very high quality. I don't expect everything to bolt together perfectly. I for one will thank Jay for putting these kits together for us, I don't know Jay very well but from what I can see he is one of those honest stand up guys that will do whatever it takes to make it right

so chinook please start a thread of your own. And I'll post there if I run into any Issues

avnxtek
07-13-2017, 09:18 AM
I am at KBIV. It would be fun to fly up and see your progress.

Any time Cubob. I'm building at home about 12 miles from airport
ill send you a PM with my number

chinook
07-13-2017, 02:30 PM
I noticed your other posts on this subject and find this disturbing. Did you visually check ALL of the welded joints? What did they look like? A good visual check will often point out a potential leak location. Second, when you have a question you can pressurize the tank with a maximum of 3-5 psi air. Then with a soapy water solution brush over all the seams, look for minute air bubbles.

Frankly I'm shocked that you have three bad tanks from Javron. Where were your leaks located? In a weld or a threaded joint?
All the leaks are in welds most are in the spot welds holding the baffling in the tank one one tank it is also on the seams on the side I did a pressure test to two pounds but it was when I added Av gas in that I found the leaks

WanaBNACub
07-13-2017, 10:58 PM
Very nice! I will be following this build as well. When I finish my cub rebuild I am going to be starting on a scratch built experimental!

avnxtek
09-12-2017, 02:02 PM
Making some progress, have been working on the fuel system.


32745

32747

So one question I have The line with the yellow tape on it, what is the best way to make this connection?
I see some with a fitting and some with rubber line any suggestions

skywagon8a
09-12-2017, 02:45 PM
I like aluminum fittings and used them 100% on my Cub. Piper used rubber hose with a clamp on each end. If the clamp isn't tight there is the possibility of a leak. Rubber hose can deteriorate so when the connection is in a blind area there will always be some doubt.

avnxtek
01-20-2018, 08:59 AM
My how time flies when you're having fun. I'm getting a few things together

Floorboards going in. Love that carbon fiber
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A few other parts and pieces installed
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Tail is is on and rigged and they actually move how they are supposed to
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Firewall and boot cowl. Quality stuff
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34792

Way two much fun
34793

And this his weekend I hope to finish the windshield
and maybe get some rivets pounded in the firewall

34794

Thats it for now. Off to have more fun

Bill Rusk
01-20-2018, 09:46 AM
Looks great. Thank you for posting. It is fun and interesting to see it come together.

Bill

Steve Pierce
01-20-2018, 01:27 PM
Way two much fun
34793




Great picture. Looks like you are having fun. Hang on to that drill. I have one just like it but still has the blue paint on it. Made in Germany and distributed by Snap on. Can't find them anymore and it is my favorite drill.

Mspindler
01-22-2018, 07:29 AM
Thanks for the photos helping me a lot . just received my kit Thursday Mike

flylowslow
01-22-2018, 10:49 AM
Picking up my fuselage from Javron tomorrow! Like Bill says, I feel blessed! Can't wait to start going up!

avnxtek
01-22-2018, 11:29 AM
Thanks for the photos helping me a lot . just received my kit Thursday Mike


Picking up my fuselage from Javron tomorrow! Like Bill says, I feel blessed! Can't wait to start going up!

Great One little piece at a time and we will have them flying before we know it.

And make sure you show us your progress

avnxtek
03-04-2018, 11:17 AM
So Iím at the point of laying some cover down and looking for some advice. Starting with the elevators
35482

The Piper drawing shows round patches over the tie points. Most cubs I see have a 2Ē tape over the rib.

Builders choice or is it best to have the tape over the entire rib


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Bill Rusk
03-04-2018, 11:32 AM
Really just builders choice. I prefer the tape. A little more protection for an area that takes a lot of abuse from prop blast, dirt, water spray (if on floats) etc. and I think it looks better.

my opinion only

Bill

Steve Pierce
03-04-2018, 12:33 PM
I agree with Bill. That fabric drums a lot and you will get less paint cracking along the ribs if you use tape instead of dollar patches.

avnxtek
03-04-2018, 12:42 PM
Copy that
And thanks for the quick response

I may add a couple tie points also


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flylowslow
03-05-2018, 09:37 AM
Where did you get your windshield fairing strips? Looks like an excellent fit from the picture.

Thanks,
Denny

avnxtek
03-05-2018, 11:15 AM
Fairing Came from Javron Not sure if He makes them or not but I'm really happy with it
Just a few more little adjustments and it will be good to go


35485

avnxtek
03-11-2018, 05:02 PM
Another cover question
I have the horizontal stabs and elevators covered and about to tape and the ribs between the two donít quite line up maybe 1/2Ē offset so do you offset the tape to keep them true or?

35620


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skywagon8a
03-11-2018, 06:05 PM
Are you doing a two foot or a ten foot covering job? :wink:

No seriously your attention to detail is commendable. In my opinion trying to match the tapes between the two surfaces will look better if your tapes are centered on their respective ribs. If not you will forever wish that they were. The tapes being off set on their own rib will be more obvious to your eye.

Steve Pierce
03-11-2018, 08:13 PM
I agree, center over the rib itself.

avnxtek
03-12-2018, 09:33 PM
Thanks. I was thinking centered was the way to go.
This being my first cover I'll probably be asking lots of questions
hope to start on the fuselage this weekend.
Make sure I get those parts Steve

avnxtek
06-13-2018, 10:11 AM
My how Life gets in the way of progress
Vacation, Spring Chores around the Farm, and that Work thing
But I manage to get a few things done here and there

Tail feathers are through second coat of Eco Fill and put up until the next step

37587

37588

37589

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Upper baggage compartment and rear bulkhead

37592

37593

Fuselage cover up next
Fun Fun

Lowrider
06-13-2018, 10:38 AM
Yes Sir, life does get in the way but it's worth keeping around. I have the same problem. Your doing nice work on your kit...keep it up!!

avnxtek
07-02-2018, 04:46 PM
Before starting to cover the fuselage I needed a rotatory so off to the scrap pile, and this is what I came up with

37841

I'm Working on a position brake but for now the straps hold it in place

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Bottom skin going on
37843



37844

Started on the sides and hope to get the time this week to continue

37845

I see fuselage tapes from minimal to over the top I have searched and can't find any guidance for them or Inspection cover placement
Again I'm sure it is builders choice any advice would be greatly appreciated

Steve Pierce
07-02-2018, 05:59 PM
Here is a link with the Piper drawing.
http://www.supercub.org/forum/showthread.php?51053-Location-of-inspection-cover-grommets

mike mcs repair
07-02-2018, 06:07 PM
Add more than they show. Under every pulley, brake masters, rudder pedals anywhere you might need to do WORK. Then only cut them out if you need to do work there.


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Steve Pierce
07-02-2018, 06:28 PM
Add more than they show. Under every pulley, brake masters, rudder pedals anywhere you might need to do WORK. Then only cut them out if you need to do work there.


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Yep, I put inspection grommets under the brake pedal, a rectangle like Piper did under the rear stick to reach the Aileron's cables and two under the two elevator cable pulleys.
37846

Steve Pierce
07-02-2018, 06:38 PM
I also install a grommets where the brake line comes out of the fuselage. Piper used an aluminum fairing there on the later Super Cubs which I cannot locate anywhere so my friends Chris and Tony made me some spares out of carbon fiber off a set of aluminum ones I have for this Super Cub I am rebuilding.
37847

37848

avnxtek
07-02-2018, 11:20 PM
Thanks. That gives me something good to go on. I really like the grommet for the brake line
do they have any more that they might let go of?

G44
07-03-2018, 12:23 AM
A thought.... Buy extra inspection covers and paint them when you paint the rest of the airplane then put them aside so if you do need to cut a hole where you have a grommet you will have a cover all ready to go.

Kurt

avnxtek
07-06-2018, 06:44 PM
Starting to look like something

37928

37929

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So do I use a 2 or 3 inch tape down the spine?

sofar so good. Fun fun

skywagon8a
07-07-2018, 06:23 AM
https://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/media/Advisory_Circular/AC_43.13-1B_w-chg1.pdf

Page 2-9
(5) For an overlapped and doped seam on the perimeter of a wing (except a leading edge), perimeters of wing control surfaces, perimeters of empennage surfaces, and all areas of a fuselage, on aircraft with a Vne speed up to and including 150 mph, overlap the fabric 1 inch and cover with a finishing tape that is at least 3 inches wide, centered on the outside edge of the overlap seam.

avnxtek
07-07-2018, 09:32 AM
https://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/media/Advisory_Circular/AC_43.13-1B_w-chg1.pdf

Page 2-9
(5) For an overlapped and doped seam on the perimeter of a wing (except a leading edge), perimeters of wing control surfaces, perimeters of empennage surfaces, and all areas of a fuselage, on aircraft with a Vne speed up to and including 150 mph, overlap the fabric 1 inch and cover with a finishing tape that is at least 3 inches wide, centered on the outside edge of the overlap seam.


Thanks for the reply. Skywagon8a
43.13-1B acceptable methods and techniques and practices. Used when no manufactures guidance is provided
i see the drawing referenced above thanks Steve. Shows 2". I also have an L21 drawing that doesn't specify at least I can't find it anywhere.
Just trying to see what others have done.
Again my first kit lots of dumb questions to come

skywagon8a
07-07-2018, 01:44 PM
37930 So do I use a 2 or 3 inch tape down the spine?
Measure from the center line of the spine to the edge of the overlap. If it's close to 1 inch you will be happier using the 3" tape as it will blend in smoother with the fabric.

Tape the leading edge of the fin first so that the fuselage spine tape will overlap the fin's tape. Blending the fuselage/fin junction can be a challenge.

avnxtek
08-27-2018, 06:36 PM
Well I think she is covered
38560

38561
38563
38562
38564

On to the next phase.

avnxtek
08-28-2018, 10:14 AM
Question for the Stewart System Experts

The latest manual Tells me to cut the E610 EcoBond 3-1 with distilled water and apply over the fabric. I did this with the Tail feathers and am happy with the results.
The manual also says that you can apply EcoFill without EcoBond First ??
From what I have been able to gather this change was made to improve cooler temp. application

All of the videos I have seen go straight to EcoFill

So Do I Don't I?
What have others done?
Any other explanations for this manual change?

avnxtek
09-06-2018, 11:17 AM
wow must not be many Stewart systems users

anyway I went buy the book and got to the second brush on coat of Eco fill
38743

38744

First Eco bond to fill the weave of the fabric. Brushed on in multiple directions and a very thin coat this stuff will run!
I kept the surface flat until it tacked up

38745

38746

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Eco fill goes on real nice again I kept the surface flat until tacky and moved on
I'm learning as I go and I hope this might help someone

Gordon Misch
09-06-2018, 01:21 PM
First coats have to go on light, or they will for sure run! Furthermore, I've learned the hard way to not depend on flat orientation to accommodate putting the material on heavy. I ran into adhesion issues doing that.

I've found that with Stewart's if I don't try to rush it, it works great. Fortunately EcoFill sands pretty well if (when!) needed.

skywagon8a
09-06-2018, 03:08 PM
Question for the Stewart System Experts


wow must not be many Stewart systems users

anyway I went buy the book and got to the second brush on coat of Eco fill
Your first question was for experts. I've used it and like it but am certainly not an expert. I would need to get out the book again when I use it the next time. It's different than nitrate dope on Irish linen which is what I'm used to.

avnxtek
09-06-2018, 03:47 PM
Your first question was for experts. I've used it and like it but am certainly not an expert. I would need to get out the book again when I use it the next time. It's different than nitrate dope on Irish linen which is what I'm used to.

Yup should have used the words Stewart System users.
Maybe I would have a few more responses

going by the book and learning the system. Happy with the results sofar

it's all fun

avnxtek
10-03-2018, 02:05 PM
What a great day!
Looks like I get to start on the cowling this weekend

39135


Just more Fun

avnxtek
10-08-2018, 12:29 PM
I need to finish my upholstery project before I move on the the Engine installation

This takes some time but is still fun

39225

All Weekend and I just got the back seat together
39226

And the harnesses came in this week

39227

Now on to the front seat

flylow
10-08-2018, 12:44 PM
Cool seats! You making everything on this cub :-)

Fun watching your build.

avnxtek
10-08-2018, 02:08 PM
Cool seats! You making everything on this cub :-)

Fun watching your build.


Thanks Flylow
It is my goal to do everything possible myself with this build

Jim A.
10-08-2018, 08:21 PM
Nice job. Those look great! Envious of people with upholstery and sewing skills. Two inherited sewing machines in my shop, need to one day get results half as good as yours. Very nice.

mike mcs repair
10-08-2018, 10:07 PM
Nice job. Those look great! Envious of people with upholstery and sewing skills. Two inherited sewing machines in my shop, need to one day get results half as good as yours. Very nice.

When I was 17 I made a complete new interior for a car I was given before I even tried to get it running. Luckily my step fathers friend had a boat upholstery shop and gave me a few pointers and ordered the material for me in Naknek. My mom taught me how to sew when I was 5. Only one rule donít sew over a finger. That was about it. Still have her sewing machine. And a monster fast big singer from the sail boat days.


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Jim A.
10-09-2018, 01:46 AM
Sounds familiar. Mom and I made the headliner for my first car, a 53' Buick. The machines I have are her old units. I was a hammerhead when I was younger, results were the most important, learning and remembering how to repeat them 30yrs or so later seemed less important at the time. Mom and Dad are still around, hoping to get them involved in my snail's pace build. Again, very nice stuff avnxtek!

avnxtek
10-09-2018, 07:17 AM
Thanks Jim, Mike (and don't look to close)
i remember doing some projects with Mom when I was young then in the 90s we had a 172C and the seats were falling apart so I got the old machine from Mom and made covers, at that time making them was the only option and they turned out pretty good. Still have that machine also. I found this big machine for this project and I think I could sew plywood together with this thing! And it can be way to fast if you don't watch it. Just like most things Prep,Prep, Prep and patience and you can do it.

and it's all fun

avnxtek
10-18-2018, 09:53 PM
Well got the front seat finished up today

39369

39370

More fun begins tomorrow

avnxtek
10-28-2018, 09:54 PM
A little more progress
39518

avnxtek
11-05-2018, 07:41 AM
Some fun with the cowling

Top supports installed

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39646

With the 2" lowered mount the Vetterman exhaust is a little tight
I'm amazed at the quality of experimental parts. This exhaust is a work
of art
39647

With my poster board mock up. I placed the lower cowl vents
a little foreword to give me some clearance about a 1/2 inch

39648

39649

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A few little adjustments and I'll start on the real thing

skywagon8a
11-05-2018, 07:59 AM
avnxtek,
You should increase the amount of belly in your lower cowl. This will give you more clearance with the exhaust and also a larger hot air exhaust at the bottom aft end. You may even be able to eliminate those belly scoops with the use of a lip just ahead of the large opening.

skywagon8a
11-05-2018, 08:03 AM
39647
Also rotate that front clamp on the muff to prevent it from hitting the lower cowl support channel. It could tap the channel making you think that there is something seriously wrong with the engine.

stewartb
11-05-2018, 08:42 AM
Mike made a form out of 2x lumber to press soft 032 into rounded-end scoops. I can send pics if you're interested.

The project looks great. Thanks for sharing.39651

avnxtek
11-05-2018, 11:53 AM
I'll probably do a combination of lower bottom cowl and cowl scoops.
That's the value of poster board lot's of trial and error to go
Thanks for the ideas

pictures are very deceiving lots of space between the lower support and the clamp
When I get to final assembly everything will be positioned for max. clearance for sure





Also rotate that front clamp on the muff to prevent it from hitting the lower cowl support channel. It could tap the channel making you think that there is something seriously wrong with the engine.

stewartb
11-05-2018, 12:34 PM
How do you lower the bottom cowl without changing the nose bowl?

RaisedByWolves
11-05-2018, 01:15 PM
How do you lower the bottom cowl without changing the nose bowl?

When I made my lower cowl I used mikes advice, and when itís flat, extend the distance between cowl attachment holes if that makes sense. Drops the air filter scoop down. Most stock cubs the cowl is touching the air box, on round filter cubs


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avnxtek
11-05-2018, 02:16 PM
When I made my lower cowl I used mikes advice, and when it’s flat, extend the distance between cowl attachment holes if that makes sense. Drops the air filter scoop down. Most stock cubs the cowl is touching the air box, on round filter cubs


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So you mean a little more distance between mounting to the lower support rail on the aft end only, giving a bit more bow to the lower cowl?
you can't change the front or it won't fit the nose bowl
My engine is 2" lower than stock and has thrustline built in so the air box is a couple inches below the lower cowl at least the way I have it now
with my poster board mock up

stewartb
11-05-2018, 02:27 PM
Exactly. My nose bowl is lower below the prop opening than most. That provided clearance for my Vetterman mufflers. The dual scoops in my picture went unused so they morphed into a full width cooling lip instead. My muffler clearance is close to the cowl but so far so good. The only nuisance is reaching the quick drain in between two hot mufflers to drain oil. I can live with that. Scoops should work fine.

What suspension will you use? Beware. Your exhaust will dump right onto your TKs or ACMEs. It's a recurring maintenance issue to remove exhaust residue.

avnxtek
11-05-2018, 02:32 PM
I have TK's so that issue has been on my mind Any one make covers for them?



Exactly. My nose bowl is lower below the prop opening than most. That provided clearance for my Vetterman mufflers. The dual scoops in my picture went unused so they morphed into a full width cooling lip instead. My muffler clearance is close to the cowl but so far so good. The only nuisance is reaching the quick drain in between two hot mufflers to drain oil. I can live with that. Scoops should work fine.

What suspension will you use? Beware. Your exhaust will dump right onto your TKs or ACMEs. It's a recurring maintenance issue to remove exhaust residue.

RaisedByWolves
11-05-2018, 02:45 PM
http://www.supercub.org/forum/showthread.php?47530-Lower-Cowl-Drawing-DWG-amp-PDF-Files


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DENNY
11-05-2018, 02:58 PM
Consider moving the lower cowl vents forward another inch or so. You want some room behind them in case you need to add seaplane lip to add cooling.
DENNY

mike mcs repair
11-05-2018, 03:48 PM
[QUOTE=avnxtek;730947]So you mean a little more distance between mounting to the lower support rail on the aft end only, giving a bit more bow to the lower cowl?
/QUOTE]

39652



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stewartb
11-05-2018, 04:05 PM
Lowered engine mount. The "rules" have changed.

avnxtek
11-05-2018, 05:02 PM
I'll give that a try with my mock-up and see where things end up

All great information Thanks.


[QUOTE=avnxtek;730947]So you mean a little more distance between mounting to the lower support rail on the aft end only, giving a bit more bow to the lower cowl?
/QUOTE]

39652



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Bearhawk Builder
11-05-2018, 06:31 PM
I did the same, that little bit makes a big difference in clearance.


When I made my lower cowl I used mikes advice, and when it’s flat, extend the distance between cowl attachment holes if that makes sense. Drops the air filter scoop down. Most stock cubs the cowl is touching the air box, on round filter cubs


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avnxtek
11-05-2018, 11:01 PM
It looks good with paper.
I think I'll go for it with aluminum

39653

39655

3965639657

mike mcs repair
11-05-2018, 11:05 PM
I'd leave out the bottom scoops at first... run it & see if they are needed... wildcatcub turned out ok without them, just a lip in back..(we had them all made)

stewartb
11-06-2018, 06:33 AM
Using the stock nose bowl the slope on the top cowl will increase and the bottom cowl flattens out. Cutting a relief and shielding that with a scoop may be necessary. Or add domes for clearance and skip the scoops. Or morph domes into scoops. Maximize cooling. Experiment. Improve. Bottom line? Do whatever you want. This is the fun part!

Farmboy
11-06-2018, 09:11 AM
And the harnesses came in this week

39227


The entire project looks great, but I'm super happy to see your new harness. :up Good man.

skywagon8a
11-06-2018, 05:09 PM
39657
I realize that your still in progress. Don't forget to install a support hanger for each tail pipe back to the engine to support the tail pipe from banging on the lower cowl.

Olibuilt
11-06-2018, 05:14 PM
Well got the front seat finished up today

39369






I really the look of those seats. Would be perfect in my plane...

Keep up the good work. Gonna be a very nice Cub for sure.

avnxtek
11-06-2018, 09:48 PM
The entire project looks great, but I'm super happy to see your new harness. :up Good man.

They are not cheap but strapped in with them you are one with the airplane. A great feeling


I realize that your still in progress. Don't forget to install a support hanger for each tail pipe back to the engine to support the tail pipe from banging on the lower cowl.

Keep an eye on me. I need it. first build right.
You probably noticed that I haven't put any holes in the firewall yet waiting to see where things will be. Heat box won't go where it's supposed to but I think I can move it up about 4" just above where it hits the engine mount and it won't be in the way of anything. And Vetterman sends a great kit with clamps and support rods


I really the look of those seats. Would be perfect in my plane...

Keep up the good work. Gonna be a very nice Cub for sure.

Well they went together better than I thought they might. Pick up a good machine and give it a try
very time consuming and lots of planning but all fun


i probably won't get back to the lower cowling until the weekend (that dam work thing keeps getting in the way of all the fun). Thanks for the suggestions the wheels are turning and will probably end up with a combination of all the ideas

mike mcs repair
11-06-2018, 10:33 PM
but the veterman (clamp)kit supposed to clamp to 'engine mount'..... better to make a brace off engine it self, less vibration....

avnxtek
11-07-2018, 10:27 AM
but the veterman (clamp)kit supposed to clamp to 'engine mount'..... better to make a brace off engine it self, less vibration....

The Kit that was sent with my exhaust has a drawing showing a brace from the engine to the exhaust and then to the engine mount in a V. They are not a solid brace they have a rubber hose in the middle

skywagon8a
11-07-2018, 01:08 PM
.... to the exhaust and then to the engine mount in a V. They are not a solid brace they have a rubber hose in the middle
Make certain that when you finish that there is NOT a solid connection between the exhaust pipe and the engine mount. If it is solid it WILL​ break in less time than you can imagine.

avnxtek
12-11-2018, 07:31 AM
More cowling fun

A little layout and cutting
40236

Fabricate some Vents and a little room for exhaust

40237

Getting it all together

40238
40241

And makeing it all fit

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40243

40244

40245

I ended up up with about 3/8" between the muffler and cowl. Hope that will be enough
I need to add a fresh air scoop for heat and a few more camlocs
its all fun.

avnxtek
01-22-2019, 11:44 AM
Just Baffling and other Firewall forward stuff

Muffler supports to the engine only they have a little flex should work fine

4106041061

Started with the Vans Baffling and did some work to get more airflow around #3
Hope that Helps keep it cool

410624106341064

Next is the Oil cooler Not sure if I want it on the Baffling or mounted to the Firewall with a duct from the baffling
Any suggestions pro's and con's

CamTom12
01-22-2019, 03:07 PM
Next is the Oil cooler Not sure if I want it on the Baffling or mounted to the Firewall with a duct from the baffling
Any suggestions pro's and con's

I just moved mine from the baffles to the firewall (with 4Ē SCAT tube feeding from the #3 side) because I kept having to rebuild cracked baffles. Though Iíve seen others that havenít cracked, but they were braced differently from mine. Looking at my old bracing, itís likely that it contributed to the cracks by focusing the vibes to an area that was likely to crack to begin with.

Just my limited experience.

DENNY
01-22-2019, 07:04 PM
You may need to add a seaplane lip to help with cooling so I would keep that in mind when it comes to the bottom cowling.
DENNY

CamTom12
01-22-2019, 08:22 PM
You may need to add a seaplane lip to help with cooling so I would keep that in mind when it comes to the bottom cowling.
DENNY

Heís got some pretty good vents on the lower cowl (post 88). If you get the top side of your cowl sealed good, Iíd bet you deal more with low temps than high ones.

skywagon8a
01-23-2019, 07:42 AM
4106041061


Next is the Oil cooler Not sure if I want it on the Baffling or mounted to the Firewall with a duct from the baffling
Any suggestions pro's and con's
What are those rubber hoses on the exhaust supports? Are they joining two pieces acting like a flexible connector? If so,good.

If you mount the oil cooler on the baffle be certain that you have substantial reinforcement to support and tie the weight of the cooler to a solid location on the engine such as the threaded holes on the cylinder head which are for the baffle screws. This support should also carry over to the crankcase. There is a 1/4" hole near the upper engine mount which is good for this.

avnxtek
01-23-2019, 03:10 PM
[QUOTE=skywagon8a;737928]What are those rubber hoses on the exhaust supports? Are they joining two pieces acting like a flexible connector? If so,good.

Exactly.
3/8 stainless tubing with 2.5" of hose. holds good and gives some dampening
im thinking the oil cooler will mount to the firewall with a support to the engine mount.
Still looking for ideas for this one.

stewartb
01-23-2019, 03:15 PM
Wouldn't solid support back to the engine be better? Those "dampers" will allow flex. With enough flex cycles something will crack and break. Wouldn't the exhaust and engine being tied together as one unit be preferred?

DENNY
01-23-2019, 04:53 PM
Kind of hard to tell from the pictures but the vents look to me to be more pockets for the exhaust. The actual open vent area looks small compared to a reg lower cowling.
DENNY

Steve Pierce
01-23-2019, 04:59 PM
Wouldn't solid support back to the engine be better? Those "dampers" will allow flex. With enough flex cycles something will crack and break. Wouldn't the exhaust and engine being tied together as one unit be preferred?

It has ball joints forward of the mufflers to allow flex and prevent cracking. That is how RVs and is how I have been doing Maules to keep from cracking the exhaust from the long arm hanging out there. Actually works very well. I have used rubber muffler strapping from the firewall as well.

stewartb
01-23-2019, 05:10 PM
Interesting. I'll look at mine tonight. My muffler hangar is rock solid and are more in line to support the weight against gravity. Works perfectly.

The dampers mounted at approx 90* from each other will pretty much cancel out any flex but how effective are they at supporting the weight? As Mike would say.... pre-flight item. ;)

avnxtek
01-23-2019, 09:22 PM
I went with this muffler support because this is what Vetterman sent with the exhaust. They do hold the mufflers solid.
I used aero quip hose and a clamptite tool to hold them in place. Don't think they will come off.
We will see and I'll keep an eye on them.

Steve Pierce
01-23-2019, 09:55 PM
I have seen them break the tabs bolted to the engine.

skywagon8a
01-24-2019, 07:16 AM
Wouldn't solid support back to the engine be better? Those "dampers" will allow flex. With enough flex cycles something will crack and break. Wouldn't the exhaust and engine being tied together as one unit be preferred?
If the supports in the above picture were solid, it would be necessary for the clamps where they attach to the tail pipe to be a loose slip fit. If not, the stresses when the pipes heat up and are shaken will break the end of the support tube or some other component where it is attached. There needs to be a place for motion even if it is only the clamp being able to slide on the tailpipe.

stewartb
01-24-2019, 11:40 AM
It makes no sense to me. I want my entire exhaust to be anchored to the engine so the entire engine-exhaust system moves at the same rate and time. If the tailpipes aren't in synch with the flanges at the engine something in between will flex, and that doesn't end well. As for the "ball joint" at the mufflers? Mine don't appear to give. I assumed the purpose was to allow some change in angle from collector to muffler, as opposed to having a welded flange. I have a hard time believing it's engineered to move, but what do I know? I found the muffler hangers interesting, and having just dealt with mine a few days ago the assembly is fresh in my mind.

I didn't mean to criticize the topic project. It looks great.

Steve Pierce
01-24-2019, 12:03 PM
If the pipes are short they are connected to the engine via a flexible attachment and if the pipes are further aft the angles don't work for attaching to the engine so they go to the airframe like Maules do. The RV guys have it figured out. I am sure it is like everything where one way doesn't work for everyone but works for some.

planenuts
01-25-2019, 09:10 AM
Avnxtek, the cowl support rods that you have attached to the motor mount, where did you find the aluminum blocks mounted on the motor mount? They look much better than the piper clamp that most use. Good looking work, I also had to put a blister on my cowling to allow room for the Vetterman exhaust, my cowl is carbon fiber so a little easier to form. Thanks

Mauleguy
01-25-2019, 09:47 AM
The ball joints should give, sounds like you have the bolts to tight, there are suppose to be springs with the 3/16 bolts and there is a measurement that came with mine for how tight it should be. Never seen an exhaust that did not break with time if it can not flex

flyrite
01-25-2019, 10:10 AM
Guys in the Acro community have learned through experience (and high G’s) To hang directly to engine with no hangers. Course you also have finger straps added to flanges.Like Greg said, They all are very high maintenance. My RV-4 has hanger style. Has been trouble free for alota hours.

avnxtek
01-25-2019, 10:22 AM
Avnxtek, the cowl support rods that you have attached to the motor mount, where did you find the aluminum blocks mounted on the motor mount? They look much better than the piper clamp that most use. Good looking work, I also had to put a blister on my cowling to allow room for the Vetterman exhaust, my cowl is carbon fiber so a little easier to form. Thanks


I couldn't find anything i liked so I had to make them myself. Experimental aircraft are so much fun

flyrite
01-25-2019, 06:12 PM
I have seen them break the tabs bolted to the engine.



This is what we do to avoid that ...Finger straps on my buddies Bearhawk

41125

avnxtek
01-25-2019, 07:20 PM
Kind of hard to tell from the pictures but the vents look to me to be more pockets for the exhaust. The actual open vent area looks small compared to a reg lower cowling.
DENNY

They were made to give clearance for the mufflers more than anything. they are small for a cowling vent I think they look better than a pocket for clearance and will help some. Once I get everything in place I'll probably work on a seaplane lip also

skywagon8a
01-26-2019, 06:24 AM
41061
Is this for carb heat? If so, if you find that you need more heat you could close up that opening considerably.

avnxtek
03-04-2019, 04:19 PM
Just about have this Baffling done
I have the Baffling around the flywheel to go yet. I see some use it and some don't any opinions on that?
I'll wait on the seal until the final install

41805

41806

Oil Cooler went to the Firewall I'm waiting on some flanges to come in to finish that up

41807

Been working on the Throttle levers for a long time now Finally got them done
the bracket holding the cable is just a temp

41808

41809

Hope to get this Firewall forward done so I can start on the Wings

All Fun

skywagon8a
03-04-2019, 04:51 PM
I have the Baffling around the flywheel to go yet. I see some use it and some don't any opinions on that?
Just fit your baffles tight enough to prevent as much airflow as possible to pass from the top to the underneath in this area, You want all of the cooling air to pass through the cylinder fins. Some make a streamlined shroud that fits behind the flywheel others just fit flat stock in tight. Same results. If you had a high speed airplane it may pay off to spend some time with streamlining the baffles.

tempdoug
03-04-2019, 05:02 PM
where did you get the throttle levers, pretty cool.

avnxtek
03-04-2019, 07:25 PM
where did you get the throttle levers, pretty cool.

Like most things I can't find what I want so I have to make them

tempdoug
03-05-2019, 12:24 PM
very nice.