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Steve Pierce
08-08-2015, 04:46 PM
Super Cub 91246 is a 1982 model PA18-150 with a little over 1500 hours of total time. It is interesting because it left Piper and went straight to EDO and was fitted with floats. Over the years it spent about 160 hours on floats in Minnesota before being sold and relocated to New Mexico. My daughter Tabitha and I became associated with the airplane after it was involved in a landing incident in New Mexico. She recovered it out of the mountains after 4 hours of two track roads west of Truth or Consequences. She and my father-in-law disassembled it and transported it back here where I helped the owner buy a flying Super Cub and I bought the wreck. Tabitha and I started disassembling and repairs but after a short time I realized with the shop and my work load I was not going to be able to devote the after hours time needed to get it back into the air in a timely manner. Our initial plan was to rebuild the airplane on speculation and then to sell it. Well I know myself well enough to know that I would not be able to let go of it once completed and the never ending questions of what modifications, panel layout, colors etc. kept popping up.

One Sunday morning I got an email from Nightflyer with a lot of pictures of a Super Cub he was looking to buy. After scanning the high resolution pictures I found a lot of discrepancies for what the owner wanted for the airplane. Having been involved in several annual inspections on freshly restored Super Cubs that had a lot of money thrown at them but the methods and techniques were some what lacking I have gotten very pessimistic in regards to some of these fresh rebuilds. I emailed Nightflyer back a lot of highlighted and marked up pictures of issues I saw. He replied back with a request to help him find a nice airplane. As I sat on the couch drinking coffee I thought to myself, I could sell him 91246 and we could build it like he wants it if he is willing to wait while it is built. After discussing these thoughts with Cathy I emailed him my proposal and we sat up a day for him to look the project over. Needless to say he liked the idea of building a Super Cub the way he wanted it and the deal was struck. My main goal with this thread is to document the rebuild of 91246 but another is to try and pass on some of the things I have learned over the last several years on how Piper did certain things and why. I have had the opportunity to disassemble and restore several late model, pretty original Super Cubs and in doing so I have found things that Piper did that have been left out in the subsequent rebuilds. Now not to say that I am a purist and want to rebuild them like they left the factory but that Piper did know what they were doing and there were reasons they did things the way they did. Also something that I believe strongly is that every time a modification is made it usually effects 2,3 or 4 other things. So, now I will try and document the restoration of Super Cub 91246.

Steve Pierce
08-08-2015, 04:53 PM
These are the pictures I was sent showing the damage incurred during the landing incident. Both front and rear spars of the right wing are bent, right elevator counter balance bent and tail of the fuselage is twisted.
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Steve Pierce
08-08-2015, 04:55 PM
Tabitha and my father-in-law Bill had lots of help disassembling and loading.
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SteveE
08-08-2015, 04:57 PM
Isn't there a time limit on these threads.? [emoji41]


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aktango58
08-08-2015, 05:30 PM
Attachment, (and previous poster) not valid

Steve Pierce
08-08-2015, 05:56 PM
A lot of the late model Lockhaven built Super Cubs had full metal bellies. Makes it easy to inspect. You can see the bent bottom longeron and diagonal tubes here.
21214 21215

nightflyer
08-08-2015, 05:57 PM
It should take about a month to get finished right? ;-)

Steve Pierce
08-08-2015, 06:05 PM
Piper also went to metal flaps and ailerons on the later model Super Cubs. They are counter weighted thus heavier and some say the airfoil got changed because of the different construction. It is hard to find replacements sometimes.
21216

We have a few slackers when there is a lot of work to do.
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Jasperfield
08-08-2015, 06:12 PM
I'm looking forward to this new thread and expect to learn lots of things from it.

Steve Pierce
08-08-2015, 06:19 PM
Bent both spars. For some reason I didn't get a picture of the rear one but this is the front one bent just inboard of the lift strut fittings. Note the stamped nose ribs, Piper started using these in the late 1970s and there Vero Beach Super Cubs had stamped full ribs as well. They were a little different than the Univair stamped ribs which are 5052-H34, Piper stamped them out of 2024-) and then heat treated them. You can also see the ground wire for the stall warning horn that was factory installed in the right wing of the later model Super Cubs.
21218

The usual busted ash wing tip bow.
21219


And you can't uncover an airplane without finding a mouse nest somewhere. Note the bent false spar as well.
21220

Steve Pierce
08-08-2015, 06:33 PM
Being that this Super Cub had the original, Piper installed Ceconite fabric on it there are little things that somehow get lost when the old fabric gets removed. I had never seen these plastic fairings over where the flap cables exit the fuselage. Note that someone added the foam weatherstripping to the fuselage under the wing root fairing. You can also see the single swedged cables that Piper made instead of the three individual swedges normally seen on other aircraft or after market cables. (In 1970 Piper started started using Ceconite fabric. That is also the same year they started TIG welding the fuselages which stretched 9/16" over the oxy/acetylene welded frames.)

21221

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Steve Pierce
08-08-2015, 06:35 PM
The front aileron balance cables rub on these rub strips where the cables exit the fuselage and enter the wings. Piper used lots of friction tape and then varnished over it.

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aktango58
08-08-2015, 07:40 PM
Your attention to details and showing/telling us is much appreciated.

Lots to learn about what is 'original'.

skywagon8a
08-09-2015, 06:03 AM
21221

Steve,
Do you suppose that someone added this rain gutter in the field because the water was getting in onto the headliner? Or is there evidence that Piper did it? It looks as though they tried a weather strip first and that perhaps the leaking was only on the right side. It does look like a good idea. I seem to recall making little hoods out of fabric for this purpose.

55-PA18A
08-09-2015, 01:09 PM
Steve,
Thanks for these photos and the information.

Overall, the damage doesn't look all that bad.

Is the tail section damage the kind that "boxing" the tail tubing is supposed to help, was was something else going on during the "event"?

I've been told that when wings get bent like this, the spars bend inboard of the strut attachment. Just like we see here.

Do you see any problems with the strut attach hardware, and are you going to install the Attlee Dodge strut attach reinforcements? How about the Hurricane Tie-Downs?

Interesting mouse nest. Those little beggars had to carry that insulation a long ways to get it in there. I notice there doesn't seem to be any chewing on the wing stitching. I would think mice in the wing would be a real problem on the stitching and lacing, but have been told they don't chew on waxed stitching. Are those pieces of rib lacing in the nest ?

Looking forward to updates.

Jim

Steve Pierce
08-09-2015, 08:42 PM
Steve,
Do you suppose that someone added this rain gutter in the field because the water was getting in onto the headliner? Or is there evidence that Piper did it? It looks as though they tried a weather strip first and that perhaps the leaking was only on the right side. It does look like a good idea. I seem to recall making little hoods out of fabric for this purpose.
i believe these are factory installed only because the glue matches what the headliner was installed with.

Steve Pierce
08-09-2015, 08:53 PM
Steve,
Thanks for these photos and the information.

Overall, the damage doesn't look all that bad.

Is the tail section damage the kind that "boxing" the tail tubing is supposed to help, was was something else going on during the "event"?

I've been told that when wings get bent like this, the spars bend inboard of the strut attachment. Just like we see here.

Do you see any problems with the strut attach hardware, and are you going to install the Attlee Dodge strut attach reinforcements? How about the Hurricane Tie-Downs?

Interesting mouse nest. Those little beggars had to carry that insulation a long ways to get it in there. I notice there doesn't seem to be any chewing on the wing stitching. I would think mice in the wing would be a real problem on the stitching and lacing, but have been told they don't chew on waxed stitching. Are those pieces of rib lacing in the nest ?

Looking forward to updates.

Jim
Boxing the tail helps strengthen the area in normal off airport use but I think in this event there would have been a failure regardless.

Most of the Cub wings I have seen have bent inboard like this. The Short wing airplanes bend outboard most of the time because there are doublets riveted above the strut attach fittings to the spar webs. I did not find any damage to the strut attach fittings. We are installing the 2K lb gross weight kit which installs a cap over the strut attach fittings on the rear spar along with a doubler on the rear strut attach fitting. I believe the doubler kit that Atlee Dodge sells is mainly to help with wind loads when tied down outside. Not sure on the spar attached wing tie downs.

i have not seen the mice eat the flat waxed rib stitching. Have seen them eat the I waxed round cord a lot. Saw one airplane with all the rib stitching eaten out of one wing.

Cannon
10-10-2015, 01:00 PM
Been following this.. Any updates?

Bill Rusk
10-11-2015, 06:46 AM
Yeah, me too. Thanks for helping us learn, Steve. Much appreciated.

Bill

Jasperfield
10-11-2015, 08:32 AM
This is useful, hard-to-come-by information, thanks.

nightflyer
10-11-2015, 09:33 AM
Steve is much better at doing this but I'll add some of the pictures that I have so far. The right wing that was damaged has been rebuilt and is waiting for covering. The horizontal stab and rudder have been covered and are waiting for painting. Tom Ford is still flying around with my left wing on his Cub, I hope he brings it back.

nightflyer
10-11-2015, 09:42 AM
Here you can see the twist in the tail that was cut out and fixed.

nightflyer
10-11-2015, 09:46 AM
A few random pictures.
New boot cowl with titanium firewall.
Extended baggage and 180 pound STC.
X-brace.
Cargo pod tabs being welded on.

RaisedByWolves
10-11-2015, 11:30 AM
We also cut the metal belly off except for the aft clean out. That was a lot of weight saved. Went to headerless fuel too.

Steve Pierce
10-12-2015, 08:00 PM
The metal belly was 9.2 lbs. less all the steel tabs we cut off.
22218

Steve Pierce
10-12-2015, 08:07 PM
The tailpost was bent but rather than cut the top longerons loose and have to cut all the old post out we chose to splice the top part of the tailpost with a new Univair tailpost using an inner tube splice which was also used to splice the lower longerons that were bent. Almost forgot the inner sleeves in the lower longerons at the tailpost.
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Steve Pierce
10-12-2015, 08:11 PM
Installed 180 lb baggage STC less the 3rd seat belt attach fittings.
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Steve Pierce
10-12-2015, 08:15 PM
Dakota Cub's adjustable rear seat STC which allows you to move the seat back 3".
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Steve Pierce
10-12-2015, 08:21 PM
1/4"x28 nut welded to the oil hole on the rear stabilizer carry-thru for a grease zerk. Requires reaming aftervwelding.
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Bushing welded to the tail spring fitting. Needs to be sanded smooth so the bolt and washer sit flat on the fitting.
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cary duncan
10-12-2015, 08:28 PM
I have an original 78 cub with the exact thing on both wings, so assume that is the way it came from the factory.

Steve Pierce
10-12-2015, 08:35 PM
My Super Cub has well over 12,000 hours and the door pins and the sockets that the door pins fit into are worn and let the door rattle. It doesn't take 12K hours to do this. I started welding bushings in the recepticles to make a tight fit and to keep from wearing a notch in the pins.
Front receptical.
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Rear receptical.
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Note the hole drilled in the "U" channel that makes up the seal for the flip up window and has 3 #4 PK screws screwed into it to retain the rear "D" window. There is no where for water to escape this channel that is welded over a round tube. I have found lots of these rusted completely through. This is a 1500 hr airframe with an aluminized coating from the factory that we found no corrosion on so instead of cutting the channel off like I normally do I used a Blair hole cutter and drilled a hole in the channel to inspect the tube underneath.

Steve Pierce
10-12-2015, 08:44 PM
The two most important safety modifications that I install on all rebuilds.
The top deck "X" brace from Atlee Dodge. Have gone strict into the ground from 100' in a PA16 that has the same upper deck structure I have seen the rear spar carry-thru collapse into the cockpit.
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I have also seen the results of the seat breaking away from the fuselage sending the pilot, shoulder harness or not into the instrument panel. Atlee Dodge STC for installing the seat belts to the floor is a must in my opinion.
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Steve Pierce
10-12-2015, 08:54 PM
I also got the idea for this from Wayne Mackey. It is piper 3/8" channel forming the inspection cover frame where the aileron cables attach to the bottom of the rear stick. I use 6/32 nut plates in the channel to retain the inspection plate. This frame serves several purposes, it holds the inspection panel more securley with less drumming which cracks the original plastic inspection grommets, it also keeps things from jamming the bottom of the stick by keeping things from migrating in between them. It also moves the center stringer back so things don't get jammed between it and the bottom of the stick and will help with clearance when Mark gets his STC for the extension tab. ;)
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Steve Pierce
10-12-2015, 09:00 PM
Atlee Dodge sells Butch Cavanaugh's STC for the large baggage door structure that removes the diagonal tube and replaces it with a dog leg. The door and opening frame are not called out in the STC and have not been installed yet.
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OLDCROWE
10-13-2015, 06:27 AM
Dakota Cub's adjustable rear seat STC which allows you to move the seat back 3".
22221
22222This mod makes the rear seat quite comfortable...

behindpropellers
10-13-2015, 04:58 PM
1/4"x28 nut welded to the oil hole on the rear stabilizer carry-thru for a grease zerk. Requires reaming aftervwelding.

Bushing welded to the tail spring fitting. Needs to be sanded smooth so the bolt and washer sit flat on the fitting.
22224

You can also add some tabs around the bolt head to keep it from spinning. Sure is nice to have a person like Steve rebuild your cub. The guy who recovered mine neglected to put several inspection covers back in place. After the razor blade it is air brush time.
22235

Steve Pierce
10-13-2015, 05:22 PM
You can also add some tabs around the bolt head to keep it from spinning.
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Awesome idea Tim.

Steve Pierce
10-13-2015, 05:35 PM
We take a sharp tip burr and center up the holes for the boot cowl screws and install 6-32 nut plate in them. Also knock out the riv-nuts at the trailing edge of the skylight and the leading edge of the long top wing root fairing adjacent the fuel tank cover and install nut plates there as well.
22237

Steve Pierce
10-13-2015, 05:40 PM
22238

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Steve Pierce
10-13-2015, 05:48 PM
Made and welded tabs in for the belly pod. They are shorter than the tabs you fish through the slit in your fabric and around the longer on so I have to use a long turn barrel in place of the short one that comes with the Alaska Bush Pod. Also figured out I would have had a problem with that slip over the longer on clamp and the bottom leg of the dog leg for the larger baggage door opening. Glad we welded tabs on.
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skywagon8a
10-14-2015, 07:27 AM
You can also add some tabs around the bolt head to keep it from spinning. Sure is nice to have a person like Steve rebuild your cub. The guy who recovered mine neglected to put several inspection covers back in place. After the razor blade it is air brush time.
22235
Excellent idea, just remember that "all AN bolts" are not created equal. The relationship between the face of the hex and the OD of the grip is not always exactly the same and symmetrical. If these tabs are tight for one bolt, the next bolt may or may not fit.

Steve Pierce
06-01-2017, 03:33 PM
Well it has been a while. Finished the recover of this Clipped Winged Cub.
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Repaired this damaged Pacer.
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Completed the rebuild on this Super Cub.
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Completed my usual annual and condition inspections and have gone from 4 employees to none. I am now getting back to Super Cub 91246 full time. I have some pictures to catch up on since my daughter got everything covered except the fuselage before she and her husband moved out of town. I will try and catch up the progress in both pictures and dialog and keep this thread up as the airplane comes together. Thankfully Jason has been a very understanding owner. :oops:

Steve Pierce
06-01-2017, 06:35 PM
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170601/5f0b9cf038ae630478eb4ba24476b626.jpg

For some reason the last two Super Cubs I have rebuilt have had this issue of the bottom of the fuel tank rubbing on the channel brace between the butt rib and the front spar. The short wing aircraft have felt glued on these channels. Because of this the last time I order felt a got a roll of 3/8" and 1/2" to glue to these channels.

We stripped the paint in the damaged ares and my welder buddy welded them up and welded the front fuel pick up bung into the right wing tank for the Dakota Cub header less fuel system STC.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170601/a261ada1d99163254b9fbfc1b9c8cbf6.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170601/893baae950a31f9c1eca269cf837206d.jpg

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Bearhawk Builder
06-02-2017, 04:22 AM
Dakota has a headerless fuel system?

Steve Pierce
06-02-2017, 07:33 AM
Dakota has a headerless fuel system?
Yes, it incorporates their vented gas caps, machined gascolator and fuel valve. Their fuel valve has the stops machined into the valve to meet the FAA requirements to only go to off one way. Doesn't need the two bolts and bushings installed on the fuel valve cover like Cub Crafters.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170602/c7cacdf2dbac682191c2000a9c77e5b6.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170602/97842c53463da54327d8080c5d3d2587.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170602/52fd2a1570eab9c251d37e60aee612b1.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170602/bd0c090fd622119891b3bd4398099be4.jpg

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RaisedByWolves
06-02-2017, 11:21 AM
Joes turned out great, love the paint job. It's one of my favorite schemes

Steve Pierce
06-02-2017, 11:32 AM
He was a happy camper. Took some time to get him up to speed on the CGR30P and the Trig radios. The paint scheme took a lot of head scratching but I like that year model as well. Now Eaton has someone to blame when he gets a phone call from the Feds.
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OLDCROWE
06-02-2017, 11:36 AM
Cool interior selections, must have hired a designer :lol:

Steve Pierce
06-02-2017, 11:46 AM
Cool interior selections, must have hired a designer :lol:

Yep, that would be the collaboration between you and Tabitha. Joe did say that coming down and seeing your Super Cub when it was done cost him a lot of money. Up until that point it was suppose to be just a recover. I always say there is what you know needs to be done, what you find when you get it apart and the "while we are here we might as well..." 8)

behindpropellers
06-02-2017, 12:21 PM
Forgot vernier mixture.

Steve Pierce
06-02-2017, 12:29 PM
Forgot vernier mixture.

I prefer the A-740 ratchet cable. Doesn't crepe and doesn't protrude so far back behind the panel before it can turn. I use them on mixture, carburetor heat, cabin heat and cabin air. Some like the vernier but it is still a carbureted unequal length intake tubed O-320.
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/a7401.php?clickkey=28423

CamTom12
06-03-2017, 08:35 AM
I'm a big fan of how the red/white one (Joe's?) turned out!

KevinJ
06-03-2017, 02:27 PM
Joe's cub is indeed as nice in person as it is in the pics. Not sure anything could be improved on the panel. Even with a lot of the small mods it still looks like a stock -18 which is what Joe wanted.....just needs bigger tires and I am holding on to a set of 100hr 31"s hoping to one day convert him to the dark side!

bcone1381
06-04-2017, 08:22 PM
Can you school me on the iPad mount, software app that he is running, and supporting hardware that is required to run this system?

Steve Pierce
06-04-2017, 08:50 PM
RAM EZ Roll'r Mount and Foreflight software.

CamTom12
06-04-2017, 08:52 PM
Can you school me on the iPad mount, software app that he is running, and supporting hardware that is required to run this system?

Software is ForeFlight. To run the attitude indicator like he is requires a Stratus 2S or a homebuilt Stratux with an AHRS module. Not sure on the mount.

Eddie Foy
06-05-2017, 04:42 AM
Software is ForeFlight. To run the attitude indicator like he is requires a Stratus 2S or a homebuilt Stratux with an AHRS module. Not sure on the mount.

Actually, the display says "no attitude information." Either no AHRS or it is turned off. You can still get the synthetic vision without the Stratus.

Steve Pierce
06-27-2017, 06:32 PM
So we got back from a great trip to Johnson Creek and I am back on the Super Cub. been going through all the parts that were tagged and bagged when we disassembled the airplane. Got the steel parts blasted, epoxy primed and then top coated with polyurethane. Then made huge list to order from both Aircraft Spruce and Univair. Over the years with the disassembly of 5 original, never recovered Super Cubs and all the drawings I have collected I have come up with a pretty good hardware list for each assembly as noted in each page of my Super Cub parts manual. So I have been assembling sub-assemblies and putting all the new hardware in bags to go with the others parts and putting it in my parts cabinet. I hate looking for parts. Since I got back Sac (Sneak Attack Cat) was a bit lonely, curious and wanted some attention or perhaps just to help.
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Steve Pierce
06-27-2017, 06:36 PM
Rudder pedals were worn where the springs wrap around pretty good for 1600 hours.
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I have welded a tube inside the tube but we decided to replace the pedals along with the return springs since they tend to wear at the radius and break. Had a Super Cub here on Sunday with 2000 hrs with a broken rudder return spring.
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Steve Pierce
06-27-2017, 06:42 PM
The later model Super Cubs had the short stick used in the rear in the front as well. Ordered a new front, long stick from Dakota Cub. It is a bit tight on the stick stub so I had to use a flapper wheel to clean out a little material to get the two to fit together. Then I took the stick up to my buddy Lan at Young County Machine to drill the hole in the stick on his mill. Fit perfect, not reaming required. Don't know what I would do without Lan half a block up the street.
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Steve Pierce
06-27-2017, 08:41 PM
A while back I took the Super Cub floor board drawings and tweaked them to the actual dimensions from original floor boards. Not sure why the drawing is wrong but since tweaking the drawings I get Lan to water jet them out of marine grade plywood. I need to modify the drawing for the seat belt brackets to the floor mod so I don't have to cut those holes by hand. I use an old floor board with big holes cut for the seat belt attach to make a tempkate.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170628/a9f40e47a396bc1d614676e98633f225.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170628/a6b0df3ec8f8e1d8d7b6103afb5341bb.jpg

I clamp plywood to the top side of the floorboards once installed and back drill the holes for the attachment tabs, rudder and brake pedals.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170628/dfe20c35344875da46f20f9f7f73d80e.jpg

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Bill Rusk
07-07-2017, 06:41 PM
Steve


Thank you for posting all the pictures and the info, it's great for those of us trying to learn about Supercubs. I appreciate the time that you have given.


Bill

WanaBNACub
07-13-2017, 10:24 PM
Looks great Steve! Love the panel in Joe's plane. Nice and simple!

Steve Pierce
07-15-2017, 04:22 PM
Temporarily installed the trim system and the flap control system so I can install the Dakota Cub headerless fuel system and the F. Atlee Dodge large extended baggage and make sure I don't have any interference. The fuel system was straight forward as I have installed several Cub Crafters headerless fuel systems. The one thing Dakota does is calls out Adel clamps or welded tabs to secure the fuel lines to fuselage structure. I am going to eliminate the clamps on the fuselage with weld on tabs. I have everything installed temporarily with Adel clamps on the fuselage tubing.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170715/84702f8ab4148f1b675439d9c711870a.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170715/79f3edac1777c7d507682734269dcb7b.jpg

I am replacing the steel and brass Weatherhead fittings with AN fittings. This one bend is kind of a pain to get with the nut and ferrule in place but not enough room to flare if bent prior flaring the tube.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170715/fbd406d01a209b3cd1854bba74c5e98a.jpg

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Steve Pierce
07-15-2017, 04:29 PM
I thought about using AN815 unions instead of the rubber hose but after talking to Mark at Dakota Cub we concluded some flex in the system might be good.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170715/0886372c4346c1b29bbf709515124ed7.jpg

I installed the Dakota Cub STC to move the rear seat aft and like every modification it effected something else. It took up the space where Piper ran the fuel line from the right tank forward to the fuel valve, over the 1/2" channel that spaces the side panel off the upper longerons enough to give enough clearance for the trim cables. I had to get creative with my spring type tubing bender to snake the fuel line in between the two rear seat fittings.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170715/3a64c0d7bc01b2fddfb479cb19c3957e.jpg

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Steve Pierce
07-15-2017, 04:35 PM
With the fuel lines installed I started on the extended baggage. We had already welded the channels in per the STC and I duplicated the trim pulley brackets from the rear of the standard baggage to the rear of the extended baggage to eliminate the trim cable rubbing on the back if the extended baggage.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170715/1833c63d3b67dfbe535f58fbd38fd8e1.jpg

32090

Didn't take into account changing the geometry would effect the next set of pulleys. Everything you change seems to effect several more things. ;)
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170715/8b42bbe5ee7e680919448f3d82fa07f4.jpg

Will have to move those pulley brackets over.

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Steve Pierce
07-15-2017, 05:01 PM
The Atlee Dodge STC really doesn't say much about the baggage compartment after the welding is done other than that the floor and back panel shall be a minimum thickness of .020" 2024-T3 aluminum or similar material. I used .020" for the floor and aft panel and .016" for the sides. The problem I foresaw was the side panel interfering with the trim cable. I thought about making a tunnel for the trim cable to run in but then as I looked how Piper offset the side panel in the standard baggage I figured out I could do the extended baggage the same way. I had some 1/2" U channel like Piper used in the baggage compartment and it stood the side panel off perfectly. Will weld it in along with some tabs to attach the side panels to.

Stock baggage standoff stitch welded to the top longeron.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170715/8aa578c009e3a15983b1b6f0894d6751.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170715/902233d71fb45d39f9c06ca0415ee870.jpg

My 1/2" U channels temporarily taped in place while fitting the baggage walls.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170715/831f0ac0059dd9d3133c978651f34564.jpg

Thinking about maybe running the trim indicator wire through some nylon tubing along the baggage compartment.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170715/f6ff265f10af7b5fe38c070130b36628.jpg

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Steve Pierce
07-15-2017, 05:06 PM
I really enjoy the fabrication part of a Super Cub build. I ended up cutting out for the trim pulleys where they protrude into the extended baggage compartment and will hammer out some blisters on the shop bag to cover them up in thr end. This gives maximum space with the least amount of protrusions for snagging sleeping bags etc. Since we are installing a baggage pod I figure the extended baggage will be for light stuff keeping the CG further forward with the heavier stuff in the pod.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170715/c720e90ae5ea528348c73407cb8acc8d.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170715/471886efbedf08714802f09fca646cc6.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170715/aef672b84351c44a2103a3fece800035.jpg

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Steve Pierce
07-15-2017, 05:10 PM
Since it is summer time in Texas I get a chance to spray in the morning before it gets too hot. Got all the small steel parts primed and painted and now spraying the ailerons and flaps. Got two coats on and can start the silver tomorrow.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170715/9fdfbd9f6a12bc860528f298aea154d2.jpg

Just wish I had the energy of these two. They wear each other out and then go nap.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170715/7c692be77b59dca3885ecd7d90444d5a.jpg

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robertc
07-15-2017, 07:20 PM
Since it is summer time in Texas I get a chance to spray in the morning before it gets too hot. Got all the small steel parts primed and painted and now spraying the ailerons and flaps. Got two coats on and can start the silver tomorrow.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170715/9fdfbd9f6a12bc860528f298aea154d2.jpg

Just wish I had the energy of these two. They wear each other out and then go nap.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170715/7c692be77b59dca3885ecd7d90444d5a.jpg

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I guess you just nap without wearing yourself out.

Steve Pierce
07-17-2017, 09:59 AM
Bob, I can't nap, gotta get some work done since I went to Johnson Creek and am going to Oshkosh.

Shot silver this morning as I played on the gravel bars too late yesterday morning and it got up past 90 degrees before I got back.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170717/6624892a759bdf3c04396806f9ba5f55.jpg

Since a paint can has 7" of fluid in it and Poly-Spray is mixed 4 to 1 I divided 7 by 5 and made a mixing stick. I always keep an empty can so I can shake up a can of Poly-Spray and pour it into an empty can up to the first mark carved into my stick and then pour reducer up to the second mark.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170717/6ff5fbb183a50c80f83345a13fdc5ddd.jpg

Got one cross coat sprayed and have very little to fiddle with prior to the next cross coat. Wish my daughter would come back to cover, she had it down really good.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170717/156d0be7eade0b822bc9de100ec83efe.jpg

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WanaBNACub
07-17-2017, 11:19 AM
That is a great idea for mixing silver Steve!

Steve Pierce
07-17-2017, 07:16 PM
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170718/59aef967819d64b57c5d21a151ab0514.jpg

We are installing Dakota Cub brake master cylinders because I really like not having to mess with adding and taking away fluid like you do on the sealed brake systems. This airplane had Pete's brake boosters the Airframes now sells, installed. When they were installed the installer removed the parking brake valves. Those things have gotten pricey since Scott no longer wants to sell them, Univair does have them PMA'd though. I contacted the mechanic that previously took care of 91246 and he still had the parking brake vales and shipped them to me. Appears they cut the brass close nipple that connects the stock brake to the parking brake valve with a hacksaw. Luckily an easy out got what was left of the nipple out and a pin wrench allowed me to remove the parking brake valve from the other brake back. I will disassemble and install new o'rings prior to installation.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170718/3b27083acc5113a807e85b4615258238.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170718/f1f61d8749a2ed841be2e0c05e8b7ac2.jpg

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Steve Pierce
07-19-2017, 07:47 PM
I wasted quite a bit of time because I thought I knew what the STC for the Performance Aeromotive big baggage door said. I thought I was being smart and gonna save a bunch of weight by framing the baggage door opening out of aluminum with some strategically placed tabs welded in. Got all the aluminum pieces cut, formed and fit and was pretty proud of myself till that evening when I got to thinking about it and texted a friend who has been doing the same mod on his Super Cub. He texted me the instructions and I had one of those head slapping moments. The good thing was that the aluminum parts made great patterns for the parts to be made out of .032" steel and it made quick work of it. I plan on taking the time to read and not try and go off of memory anymore.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170720/093fcb583e22257c808a78dfd0d50c80.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170720/80c862990ef0645c4c60649b45013ece.jpg

Weighed the parts, not icluding the tubing change or the door I am adding 1 lb 5 oz. in the door opening frame itself and another 1.4 oz. for the 7 Southco receptacles.

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Bill Rusk
07-20-2017, 09:14 AM
Boy, that is going to be a great mod. Love the size. Great work Steve

Bill

Steve Pierce
08-06-2017, 09:58 AM
Been working on several different things on 91246 since returning from Oshkosh. Using the original interior panels to figure out where they didn't fit very well. Biggest issue I see is at the bottom where they meet the floorboards. In some areas they go under the floorboards, others above.
I have installed all the panels, taken a scribe and scribed a line parallel to the floorboards and then sheared them off there. I then intend to install an angle on the bottom of the panel that will also fasten to the floorboard. This along with some other modifications I hope to keep the sand and grit out from under the floorboards. This is a huge problem on my own Super Cub as pointed out by a savvy passenger the other day even though I did clean it out a few months ago.

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Steve Pierce
08-06-2017, 10:13 AM
I have been laying out the instrument panel and electrical system. The panel will consist of a large open area in the middle for an iPad with a Electronics International CGR30P engine instrument, Trig TY91 radio with built in intercom, TT22 transponder with built in encoder wired into a TN70 ADSB system and a 2 1/4" digital attitude indicator.

The circuit breakers and switches will be in the panel and I intend to use circuit breaker switches where possible so I don't have to install and switch and separate circuit breaker. Have used this method on the last several Super Cubs I have built and it has worked very well.

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Eddie Foy
08-06-2017, 12:06 PM
Like this one?

32380

cubpilot2
08-07-2017, 08:26 PM
Steve:
I have done similar to what you are describing with the center open for the iPad. All of the brain box stuff for the CGR and the encoder is located on the back of the panel and is easy to access.
I chose to use the 9 inch iPad Pro as it has the best screen for use in bright light.
Also wanted to also be able to switch to other devices without having to hang them all over the place. The iPad is mounted with a modified tablet carrier with a section of aluminum hinge at the top. I can install or remove the pad in seconds by pulling the hinge pin and place it in the same folding carrier to take with me. Using the same hinge affair I will be making a separate flat plate that I can mount a GPS or iPhone or anything to and also remove easily.
The radios are all Garmin and the GTX 345 will supply attitude info to the Garmin Pilot app.
This is my long term project that is nearing completion; and of which I chose years ago to go with the square CC panel design. It has since been changed in layout for what you see.
The all switch breaker electrical is up high as I am afraid that my big feet would damage anything mounted low. The entire breaker section is removable if needed.
It is amazing how much lighter things are when you get rid of all of the gyros, pumps and hoses.

WanaBNACub
08-07-2017, 08:39 PM
I have been laying out the instrument panel and electrical system. The panel will consist of a large open area in the middle for an iPad with a Electronics International CGR30P engine instrument, Trig TY91 radio with built in intercom, TT22 transponder with built in encoder wired into a TN70 ADSB system and a 2 1/4" digital attitude indicator.

The circuit breakers and switches will be in the panel and I intend to use circuit breaker switches where possible so I don't have to install and switch and separate circuit breaker. Have used this method on the last several Super Cubs I have built and it has worked very well.

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Sounds almost just like my panel. With the circuit breaker switches it was really simple to wire. I went with the Ipad mini 4 in a IFDR panel mount. The mount comes out with 4 screws and then I have complete access to the back side of the panel for future wiring upgrades or issues.

This is with the mount out for wiring

https://scontent-frx5-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/20232942_10210254949273035_8880778647494880232_o.j pg?oh=510c0b0ee7146d23f4ea57e3bc9793f8&oe=59F2EF3D

This is with everything in place a few days ago.


https://scontent-frx5-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t31.0-8/20024231_10210332965303387_4597845838027916000_o.j pg?oh=1bdb9466db5052d09223c048e82dfe7a&oe=5A27A8EA

mike mcs repair
08-07-2017, 08:54 PM
/
I have installed all the panels, taken a scribe and scribed a line parallel to the floorboards and then sheared them off there. I then intend to install an angle on the bottom of the panel that will also fasten to the floorboard. ..

bend angle (up) into aluminum floor board edge is simplest and lightest, and keeps the crud contained...

OLDCROWE
08-07-2017, 09:12 PM
In a pinch a strip of adhesive backed foam tape works wonders, I put a dam all the way across in front of the front seat base and it stops the crud migration.

Steve Pierce
09-26-2017, 07:12 AM
I have two issues to contend with. One is the trim indicator wire breaking which is pretty common and the fact that the wire routing is not in line with the indicator cutout so it tends to wallow out the indicator groove. The other issue was routing the indicator wire around the extended baggage. My Dad used an old 1/16" trim cable in his Clipper and that was my thinking along with some nylon tubing to route it through. Then I read Clyde Smith's article in the Cub Clues about the same and reminded me of the sheath that the Pacer/Tri-Pacer trim indicator wire runs through. I aligned a clamp to hold the indicator sheath so that it was in line with the indicator groove and used the indicator from Dakota Cub that used a removable screw instead of a fixed rivet.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170926/7769885d9b74ccf99740894a948a835f.jpg

I routed the nylon sheath along the trim cable and exited through my ELT/GPS ground plane with another clamp.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170926/d5e8bbd8904f4fa54e198bb82238d140.jpg

I crimped electrical connectors onto the cable instead of wrapping the wire around itself like Piper did.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170926/92b8a69631419a305e8112183073f948.jpg

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RaisedByWolves
09-26-2017, 09:44 AM
I have two issues to contend with. One is the trim indicator wire breaking which is pretty common and the fact that the wire routing is not in line with the indicator cutout so it tends to wallow out the indicator groove. The other issue was routing the indicator wire around the extended baggage. My Dad used an old 1/16" trim cable in his Clipper and that was my thinking along with some nylon tubing to route it through. Then I read Clyde Smith's article in the Cub Clues about the same and reminded me of the sheath that the Pacer/Tri-Pacer trim indicator wire runs through. I aligned a clamp to hold the indicator sheath so that it was in line with the indicator groove and used the indicator from Dakota Cub that used a removable screw instead of a fixed rivet.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170926/7769885d9b74ccf99740894a948a835f.jpg

I routed the nylon sheath along the trim cable and exited through my ELT/GPS ground plane with another clamp.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170926/d5e8bbd8904f4fa54e198bb82238d140.jpg

I crimped electrical connectors onto the cable instead of wrapping the wire around itself like Piper did.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170926/92b8a69631419a305e8112183073f948.jpg

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I cut a piece of tubing and used the same phenolic type gromet that piper used and put it about the rear trim pulleys, basically copying the factory pulleys and indicator set up

Steve Pierce
09-26-2017, 11:59 AM
I cut a piece of tubing and used the same phenolic type gromet that piper used and put it about the rear trim pulleys, basically copying the factory pulleys and indicator set up
I probably should have just used the stock parts at the next station but the trim indicator wire angle bugged me. I hate fixing those when they break and think the 1/16" cable will eliminate that problem. Hopefully I didn't create another problem I can't foresee.

Steve Pierce
09-27-2017, 06:42 AM
I don't like the original throttle panel because like a lot of the sheet metal on a Super Cub, Piper used 3003 aluminum which forms very easily but dents and tears easy as well. I like to make them out of 2024-T3 with some reinforcement where they tend to bend and crack at the corners of the cutouts for the throttle handles. I think installing the panel between the longeron and window frame is part of the problem as well.

Since it is 56" long it has to be cut and bent with the grain but being .020" I have not had an issue with cracking using a decent set back on the brake.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170927/62382434aeb57e014021292fd9f3c4fa.jpg
Nice to have the drawing because a lot of these panels are in rough shape. Did find a few minor discrepancies.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170927/2d2900a4dca48aa849186443cba0a2d1.jpg
I had a little help as well. She thinks the pencil is a toy especially when being used.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170927/fc2388e6aaf906b88725264ce4e8befc.jpg

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Steve Pierce
09-27-2017, 06:45 AM
Cut out and marked, in the brake which takes a little fore thought to get the sequence correct so all bend are accessible.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170927/0759c42c05d0eb595bb81fe4a9bbfc63.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170927/eeae7ce9b90f1715569373d2b7a18ffc.jpg

Checking fit.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170927/3f3d4b0215ba9f724c11e3305717b062.jpg

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Steve Pierce
09-27-2017, 06:48 AM
I use to bend the little tab that stiffens the throttle cut out but like making a longer doubler to reinforce the radius where the crack. I made a U channel and flush riveted it in.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170927/16009b583640c7539a1678603946a4f3.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170927/f0a53e1cc1fe3b1d0579a5d1066e5a48.jpg

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Steve Pierce
09-27-2017, 06:50 AM
Fit good and slides in and out without bending. Helped that I rand a blade in the groove between the longeron and bottom of window frame to clean it out for easier installation.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170927/73126b4060010e632205e911325bfaa3.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170927/a279c16316e9bd2eac778bd540881db3.jpg

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OLDCROWE
09-27-2017, 06:52 AM
Sweet, and it doesn't look like a plumber did it.

nightflyer
09-27-2017, 07:23 AM
Looks great!

nightflyer
12-14-2017, 07:02 PM
I spent the last couple of days in Graham helping Steve work on my airplane. We mounted the engine with the thrust line mod, cut and fit the bottom cowl rails, cut a hole for the Sutton exhaust, and fit the new nose bowl. We decided that a removable exhaust pipe would allow for a smaller hole on the bottom cowl so he cut off the old pipe. We used some of the old cowl pieces for the fittment but those will be replaced with new ones. Once all of the cowl pieces are finished then everything will come off for paint.

Bearhawk Builder
12-15-2017, 05:12 AM
Looks great, I'm at about the same place. What do you do for the removable exhaust pipe, expand and slip over?

skywagon8a
12-15-2017, 05:57 AM
http://www.supercub.org/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=34053&d=1513299192.
Why is the nose bowl slanted back at the bottom and the trailing edge not parallel to the firewall?

Steve Pierce
12-15-2017, 07:42 AM
Why is the nose bowl slanted back at the bottom and the trailing edge not parallel to the firewall?

It is an optical illusion in the picture.

Steve Pierce
12-15-2017, 07:45 AM
Looks great, I'm at about the same place. What do you do for the removable exhaust pipe, expand and slip over?

It is an option on the Sutton Exhaust. I am ordering the removable tailpipe for my Sutton Exhaust as well. I got it at Oshkosh but still haven't installed it.

skywagon8a
12-15-2017, 08:56 AM
It is an optical illusion in the picture.
OK thanks, even taking that into consideration it doesn't look straight. I'm looking at the front push rod tube and the rocker box cover relationship to the nose bowl.

Oliver
12-15-2017, 10:23 AM
bend angle (up) into aluminum floor board edge is simplest and lightest, and keeps the crud contained...

Agree with Mike on alum floor, also provides additional fastening points for interior panels.


Great thread Steve, lots of good info, thanks for sharing.


34073

Bearhawk Builder
12-22-2017, 12:22 PM
Steve, how much of that tailpipe do you have to cut off to get the lower cowl off. Have you figured out how little you can get away with cutting?

Steve Pierce
12-22-2017, 01:51 PM
Steve, how much of that tailpipe do you have to cut off to get the lower cowl off. Have you figured out how little you can get away with cutting?This is plenty to both attach the tailpipe to and get the lower cowl on and off easily.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171222/052db5b77113090ed93a2b3d9beee420.jpg

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Steve Pierce
12-22-2017, 07:09 PM
OK thanks, even taking that into consideration it doesn't look straight. I'm looking at the front push rod tube and the rocker box cover relationship to the nose bowl.After looking at it again I noticed I did have the bottom of nose bowl too far aft. Good eye Pete. Got it adjusted and my cowl doors built with more material on the lower trailing edge to compensate for the Thrustline modification.

On the right door I started from the hinge and worked down using the old door as a pattern and compensating for the curve and marking the holes for the latches, fitting to the nose bowl lip and then the trailing edge. While talking to Thrustline Mark he told me about starting at the latches and pulling it up to the hinge. I decided to try his method on the left door. I cut out for the latches, installed them with no washers (shims) and started pulling it up, marking the line for the nose bowl and trimmed to fit. Once the door was fit to the nose bowl I marked where the edge of the cowl door hits the hinge on the nose bowl and the boot cowl, pulled the door up tight and duct taped it so I could mark my cut line. Once cut I put the door back on and clamped the door to the hinge with a long padded Vise-grip clamp and drilled one rivet hole through the door and hinge. Then I removed, drilled and riveted the hinge on. The door fits nice and tight on the nose bowl with two washers under the latches. The nice thing about this method is that the over center latches are perfectly aligned making it latch very easily.

This is always a nerve wracking yet rewarding job. I have scrapped a few doors over the years with a lot of work in them. I am very happy with the fit and finish of these. I guess I held my mouth just right. ;)
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171223/ac1f1e85e485662ab8239be49c81cd00.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171223/8dae92fcebadf9ad96370cb8e5be0497.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171223/8daaa51a610849a1ace022a5389c67c9.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171223/7e8939b0d45b09d33fc513853b004a30.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171223/0ed0a4f23a05df03b0854452ffc260de.jpg

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Bill Rusk
12-22-2017, 07:29 PM
Very nice Steve. Very nice indeed.

Bill

OLDCROWE
12-22-2017, 07:56 PM
I have flying proof that when finished this aircraft will be the second best Super Cub ever produced :lol: and without a doubt it will be well thought out with a fit and finish will be as good as is humanly possible and worth every day it took.

Kirby

nightflyer
12-22-2017, 08:19 PM
I have flying proof that when finished this aircraft will be the second best Super Cub ever produced :lol: and without a doubt it will be well thought out with a fit and finish will be as good as is humanly possible and worth every day it took.

Kirby

According to Joe Wood, his is the best Super Cub Steve ever built. :-P

KevinJ
12-22-2017, 09:04 PM
According to Joe Wood, his is the best Super Cub Steve ever built. :-P
......If it just had bigger tires;-)

nightflyer
01-12-2018, 07:50 AM
I made a quick trip out to Graham yesterday to check on the cub. The carbon fiber under seat storage is trimmed up and fitted. The large baggage door is almost finished and turned out great. Itís very light and rigid and will be painted black to match the cockpit door.