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Need manuals - local dealer won't answer

chilecubdriver

Registered User
Santiago de Chile
Hello all,

We contacted the local Piper dealer and since he hasn't answered, we called the Piper factory and they told us to get in touch with our local dealer...

Long story short, we need the following manuals, etc:

pn 752-451 IPC
pn 761-823 IPC
pn 230-202 revision check list
flight manuals for PA-18 sn 18-5317, 18-7488, 18-7541 and 18-7837.

Who do I get them from?

Regards,

Alex
 
Try Stoddards in Anchorage (907) 272-2327 or Univair (303) 375-8882
 
Here are lists of Piper Dealers in North America and below that a list of dealers in Central and South America.
Darrel
Piper_Dealers.jpg

Piper_Dlrs_in_Central_S_America.jpg
 
Mi Esposa is traveling to Santiago in early March and can hand carry these manuals if you can wait until then.

Eric
 
Most of the Piper Dealers under the "NEW PIPER AIRCRAFT CO." consider the cubs a red headed step child and it is very unlikely you will get much of a response from them. Univair & Stoddards are always Good, Knowledgeable and will Help any way they can my .02 cents
 
Thanks Clay Great to know someone associated with Piper still cares. Now if they would just start building The Cub Again :angel:
 
They won't...trust me, its a closed door. And I'm not joking when I say its all the lawyer's fault. :x
 
PA18A-135 paperwork

Clay
Could you see if You can get a copy of this document from Piper.
Last time I tried about 4 yrs ago, I hit a brick wall.

From A/C specs AR7

(b) The Model PA-18A "135" (Restricted Category) is the same as the Standard Category PA-18A "135" except for minor design changes and can be converted to the Standard Category using the manufacturer's conversion instructions dated January 17, 1952, revised June 17, 1952. When operating in Standard Category, FAA Type Certificate Data Sheet No. 1A2 will apply

I believe it is Piper Report 762

thanks
Brian
 
Clay,

I'd argue that the law suit which put Piper permanently out of the tailwheel business (and Cessna, as well, by the way) was precipitated by incredibly ignorant PILOTS. Further, Piper never took the lawsuit seriously until it was too late, and an appeal didn't change the outcome. Piper basically didn't even try to defend itself, apparently because it felt the suit was obviously "frivolous". The jury didn't agree, apparently. Had Piper actually participated in a meaningful way in the trial, the outcome may well have been different.

It's easy to bash lawyers, cause they are very visible. This particular lawsuit, however, Piper deserved to lose, in my opinion. In this case, it was they who were arrogant.

And, both pilots involved should have been immediately neutered to ensure that they not reproduce.

And, no I'm not a lawyer. I don't particularly like lawyers, but every once in a while lawyers actually do good things.

Consider the engine manufacturers: They aggressively attack EVERY suit. Their attitude is that they can't afford to open that door. Unfortunately, some folks who really SHOULD receive some compensation for their loss lose out. But, the companies hold the line, cause they know that once that door is open, a whole bunch of attorneys are going to come through it.

Had Piper done the same, i suspect they'd have won that suit.

Unfortunately for us all, they didn't.

Don't blame the lawyers in this case at least.

MTV
 
Yes Mike, all good points. But I will stand by what I said. The current, present day legal team at Piper are not interested in seeing PA-18's built by Piper or anyone else due to the risk of exposure to litigation associated with operating said aircraft. (This despite the fact that we have crazy pilots bailing out of Meridians in the dead of night) Even to the point that they will not look at the possibility of compartmentalized / firewalled divisions in the company or otherwise to see the aircraft built again.
 
Could/would you guys (who know) explain that tidbit of history? It would be an interesting thread I'd think.

But then... maybe a liar would read it 'eh?
 
Clay,

I certainly wouldn't argue your point. My point was that the lawyers are the middle men and women. It still takes a greedy litigant to engage the lawyer. Granted there are ambulance chasers out there, and those are the absolute pit of their profession, but it still takes two to tango.

Cessna's CEO was asked, when they were going back into production on single engine airplanes if they'd get back into the 180/185 market. His response was that there was no way they'd EVER get back into tailwheel production, largely due to that suit.

Nimpo,

The suit involved a fellow who owned a SC, and towed gliders with it, from a private airstrip. The strip was half on his property, and half on his neighbor's if I remember correctly. No commercial operations were permitted off the strip.

The guy with the SC was going to tow a glider, and wanted a video, so he placed a video camera in the front seat, facing aft. Video the back seat pilot, and the glider through the skylight on tow. In the meantime, his neighbor, who had repeatedly complained about the commercial glider tow op, drove a van onto the mid point of the strip, on HIS property, blocking the strip. The glider tug pilot apparently assumed he could get airborne before getting to the van. He admitted in testimony that he knew the van was there.

On takeoff, he hit the van, and in the ensuing accident, he was severely injured, which resulted in him becoming paraplegic.

He sued Piper (and his neighbor), arguing two points: one was that the airplane was not equipped with a shoulder harness in the rear seat by Piper, making it dangerous.... The second point was that the Super Cub was an "inherently dangerous" design, in that the tailwheel design precluded good visibility from the pilot seat, as I recall.

Anyway, the jury found in favor of the plaintiff on both counts, and essentially set the precedent that a tailwheel airplane is an inherently dangerous design (or words to that effect) due to it's lack of visibility out the front.

Piper did not aggressively defend that case until the jury found in favor of the plaintiff, at which point, Piper appealed. On appeal, however, it's mostly procedures that are reviewed, not facts. In this case, the appeal went nowhere.

I suspect that had Piper aggressively gone after that case from the beginning, they could POSSIBLY have convinced the jury that the plaintiff was a totally irresponsible loon, and they would have won the case.

This is all from memory, and some of the above may be in error. Someone can provide a link to the case I'm sure. This is the essence of the case, though.

MTV
 
Thanks Mike.
That's not quite as fascinating as I'd hoped, but an interesting bit o history.

I agree w/your description of the "totally irresponsible loon" and understand how Piper would have made the same assumption.

It seems to me that Piper could have accepted the bad rap for no rear shoulder harness, and just put them in after that.

BUT why quit manufacturing a perfectly good taildragger? It's not like they were the only ones doing so! I kinda suspect this was a good "excuse" to stop, for some OTHER reasons, perhaps not known.
But, alas, no one ever asks ME!!
 
Nimpo,

When that SC was built, shoulder harnesses weren't a requirement in any of this type aircraft. Later, they became required in the front seat, and even later, in the back as well. My question on that: Why would we blame Piper for not installing equipment that NOBODY was installing back then?

But the real killer was the fact that jury agreed with the plaintiff that a tailwheel airplane is a bad design cause it's hard to see out of.

Anyway, a bummer of a suit that never should have been even tried, frankly.

MTV
 
I think on aviation suits the jury should be made up of pilots, A@P"s etc. You get the idea.
 
I was only asking for some manuals and got enlightened with a piece of aviation history... the combination of stupid people and way too many lawyers is incredibly dangerous... can I get sued for saying that?

I finally ordered the manuals from good ole Univair!

Alex
 
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