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metal belly vs. fabric

T

teeweed

GONE WEST
Hempstead, Texas
If you are recovering your cub and have the choice of going with a metal belly or fabric which would you choose. Thanks
 
yo

I have an all fabric belly, but I know a couple guys up here with metal panels that allow access to the last 6 feet of their cub. It's nice to check if there is snow, etc. in your tail.

I wish my cub had that. Tony
 
Depends where you use your cub. Fabric is lighter. On floats, I feel fabric would keep more water out. But a metal belly would make it easier to touch up minor rust spots. For me, I chose to use fabric except from about the lift handle back, where I put one aluminum panel. I've taken it off once to clean out snow after a bad wind storm last winter. It makes it easier to access the elevator cables. I didn't feel the need to do the whole belly.
Webfoot
 
belly

Ditto what was said above. Having the last couple feet of metal makes it easier to inspect the tail, work on the trim system and clean all the junk that fell through the holes in the floorboards out. [empty 12 ga]
Dave
 
Metal works great for cleaning out all the snow that blows in during a blizzard, or over the course of leaving it parked for a while in the winter. That is what I like about it. Probably not as big a problem down in TX. Actually not much of a problem up here this winter.

Bill
 
If you are really working your Cub hard, definitely metal belly. You can pop it off with five Dzeus fasteners and take a good look at tubing for bends and cracks when preflighting after out pounding it. Also, provides great access to jackscrew for maintenance if need be. My metal belly is I am guessing about 3 feet long from the tailpost forward. It just takes a few tabs to weld on, and then forming the metal piece and installing five fasteners. Field approval for paperwork.
 
They did as did some late model standard PA18s. From a mechanics standpoint I love it. Easy to clean the crap out from between the longerons and the fabric and access to the jackscrew. As with everything in aviation there is a compromise on weight. I have installed a panel on the belly from the jackscrew aft. It is a simple but reasonable compromise for me.
 
We have the full metal belly and its weight is 6 lb's, I believe.

I was back and forth about it when rebuilding, but now that I have it I definately think it was the right choice. I would for sure do the last 3-4 ft of the fuselage.

I took off the last panel today just to look around. It came off in about 30 seconds and I was able to easily see or reach any of the hardware.

We also decided to do it for the reasons Steve P stated.

Do it.

Lance
 
I put metal panels under the cabin, from the boot cowl back to the float fittings, and also under the tail, with fabric in between. My J3 is on floats full time and I wanted it to be able to drain easily. I can drop the pans and clean the interior of the fuselage, even with a water hose and let it dry out good. I also did not install interior fabric, also so things can dry out.

Gregg Anderson
 
Theres a letter going around from the FAA saying that a 3' metal belly and several other items do not require a field approval.
 
What is the weight savings on a metal belly vs. fabric. I have the metal belly...I dont know how they got in there but I cleaned out two dead bull frogs when I dropped the metal panels last year. If the metal panels weigh 8 pounds and the tabs maybe a couple of pounds. What would the weight saving be for an all fabric no tabs fabric belly? Thanks
 
harneymaki said:
Am I mistaken, or did the PA-18A's have metal bellies to begin with?
Click to expand...

Yes
And if you get a standard 18 with factory metal belly, it comes with provisions to attach the spreader :roll: Like Piper couldn't figure out how not to weld those two square frames in the belly, and not cut two cutouts in the front belly panel.
 
I am recovering mine now (1956 PA-18A-150) and was thinking of putting the aft section of the belly back to metal. The only thing that is PA-18A anymore is the data plate, but it still should be legal, right?
 
I have the full metal belly and agree with all that has been said. You pay a small weight price but gain a lot of convenience. One of the things I like best is when it's time to wash the bird you don't have to lay down on your back in the mud to get the oil off the bottom.
 
Does anyone have a good picture of a metal belly installed, or off I can look at? Heard about them, but never seen one...

Steve
 
I have a '56 PA18A also, and it has a metal belly. I'd be happy to take some digital pictures of it if it would help you. But, it may be a week or so before I'm able to get them. If you'd like them, contact me and I'll send them when I get a chance.

Macky
 
Here is a photo I have on hand:
IM000809.JPG


For larger size see: http://sparky.supercub.org/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=8512&size=big
 
I have a 1959 PA18A with the original flat back and metal belly.
No way would I ever go back. Soooo easy to take down and inspect, clean and work within. If one ever begins to worry about 4 or 5 pounds just check out your abdominal girth. Cheapest weight loss for a Cub is the pilots butt. ;^)
 
Can you could install a metal belly anytime, or only during frame recovering? My plane was recently recovered but the previous owner didn't think to put a cleanout or metal belly in at the time. I would like to install the tail brace and attach the seatbelts to the frame now. I guess cutting fabric would be easier on the nerves knowing I can just make the bottom metal.

Steve
 
I wouldn't cut the belly fabric out if you don't know how the side fabric is attached. If they didn't run the side fabric down and roll / glue it around the lower longerons before putting the belly fabric on then you will loosen the entire fuselage fabric when you cut the belly out. At that point you would need to re-fabric the fuselage to get it right

I really don't like metal bellys for the following reasons. They're heavy, noisy and require you to roll the side fabric around the lower longerons creating a "J" shaped water trap the entire length of the lower longerons. I watched a guy remove the fabric from a plane done like this. Water ran out of the fabric as he cut it off the lower longerons and yes, they were rusted out.

You also have all the fasteners that need to be maintained. A better way to go is with removable floors in your baggage and extended baggage compartments. The jack screw can be serviced using the available factory access holes just fine.

As far as the seat belt mod. You can double sleeve the rear legs of the lower seat frame and step up to 1/4" bolts to add a lot of strength. In most cases where the seat came loose in a crash, it was the 3/16" rear leg bolts that split the lower leg tubing.

The tail beef up you can get from Atlee Dodge that clamps in place if you feel you really need it. A soft Baby Bushwheel tail wheel, a tail spring that flexes and flying right negates the need for this mod. also.

Take care. Crash
 
I disagree that those things negate the need for the the brace structure.

I believe Atlee's(?) bracing provides much torsional stiffness advantage.

I consider the metal belly is undesirable.
 
I think that the metal bellies are too loud and noisy. Here is what we did -- just the last three feet. This provides all the access you need.

JMB_N218JK017.jpg
 
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