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Aviator
09-19-2005, 05:22 PM
Is anyone looking at building a Pazmany PL-9 ? The performance numbers with an O-320 are comparable to a PA-18-150, but the stall speed is 10 mph lower.

pzinck
09-19-2005, 06:08 PM
My dream was to always have a real fiesler storch. Now that was a real neat early stol plane.

Steve's Aircraft (Brian)
09-20-2005, 10:59 AM
I got to ride in a Fiesler Storch once. What a neat airplane. It truly felt like I was riding on a kite. And the visibility was something else.

I also got to work on that airplane. The Argus inverted V8 is a very cool motor. Only problem with them is there are not any suitable replacement spark plugs for them. We used a mortorcycle plug that lasted about 2 hours then we had to replace them. Fold the wing in about 20 minutes with 2 guys. Big airplane too. I am 6 foot and I had to use a lader to work on the engine.

The aircraft was unfortunately sold to a collector in Greece. They crated her up and sent her over on a boat along with a Jungmister and a Jungman. Since then, friend of mine who works for Erickson Sky Crane has seen it in a hanger over there along with the Jungmister and Jungmen a PBY and a couple of other warbirds that I cant think of what they were at the moment.

One thing I did get out of working for the guy is a copy of the Maintenance manual in French and a copy of the Parts book in German. neat to look through and they actually helped me a little in the design of a pair of leading edge slats for a model 4 KitFox. The KitFox has flown at 15 MPH under the power curve at 4500 RPM (Rotax 912)

Brian

dpearce
09-20-2005, 01:32 PM
Interesting history between the cub and the storch.

The Fieseler Storch was the last dogfight victim of the western front. Pilot Duanes Francies and his observer, Lieutenant William Martin, of the 5th US Army Division, spotted a Storch circling below them while looking for ground targets in their Piper Cub. Diving on the Storch, the two men opened fire with their Colt .45s and the plane spiraled to the ground. After a short gun battle, Francies and his observer took the two Germans into custody. Lt. Martin was awarded the Air Medal for his part in the fight, but Francies would have to wait until the story was reported in Cornelius Ryan's book "The Last Battle," to finally be awarded the Distinguished Flying Cross. The USAF was 22 years late. Apart from being the last Luftwaffe plane lost in the west, this Storch was also the only enemy plane downed by pistol fire during the war.

Aviator
09-20-2005, 10:20 PM
A genuine Storch is way out of my league, but Pazmany's scaled-down knock-off seems viable. An experienced builder should be able to build one in couple of years. Just don't know how it performs in real life. Any thoughts ?

Steve's Aircraft (Brian)
09-21-2005, 11:46 AM
Don't know about the Pazmany's. But I have seen the video on the Slepcev out of Australia. Very impressive on the video, and there is a lot of info on the net.

This guy built one with a Lom Walter Mikron model 132 inverted engine in it of 120 hp.
http://www.telusplanet.net/public/jbrmhall/

I have seen pictures of the Super Storch from the same company but it seems their web site is not working right now. The Super Storch is supposed to be a 4 place version with a 0-360 lycoming.

redrooster
09-23-2005, 12:30 AM
If you like the Pazmany PL9 you might like this one also, the "Backyard Flyer" by Valley Engineering (another side of the Culver Propeller outfit). It's a VW-powered open-cockpit parasol-wing taildragger with about a 90" prop They claim that the production model two seater will soon be available, ready to fly for about $25K. Not a Cub but looks like it could be a lot of fun, check it out.

www.culverprops.com/no-name-plane.htm

Rooster

pzinck
09-23-2005, 03:50 AM
I wonder if this was the first plane to use slats? The storch featured fowler flaps,drroping ailerons and slats.I also saw an early cub pic with drooping ailerons.It is neat that lot's of this technology was available in the 30's. Those old timers were pretty clever.Imagine having to use slide rules to design airplanes. I bet these storch knockoffs are interesting.Up here in maine at the end of the world,dont get to see some of this type of neat stuff.

gpepperd
01-10-2006, 10:08 PM
I am a huge fan of the Fieseler Storch as it is one of the best STOL aircraft ever made. It holds the distinction of being the only airplane to take off and land inside a building! All this on WWII technology which is still cutting edge for STOL. I rode in a Slepcev and while it flew great due to Fieseler's design, it was an ergonomic disaster! No room for any baggage or freight, rear throttle nearly ureachable for the backseater, and no head room so the control cables were right in my hair. I have bought numerous books, Pazmany's plans and video and even tried to chase down a rumor of an original in South America. The old WWII footage in Pazmany's video is truely amazing and inspiring as the goal for STOL pereformance. The Carlson Cricket is another possibility although I don't know where that project is really at since Ernie Carlson died. I'd like to hear if anyone has anything else to add on a real Storch, PL-9 or a Carlson.

palhal
01-10-2006, 10:37 PM
I had a Storch with a Argus V-8 with a cruise prop on it. It flew at 85 MPH and burned 17 1/2 Gals an hour. My SC will take off shorter than the Storch but if the Storch had a climb prop, it might be differant. One thing the Storch will do is at idle you can pull back on the stick and control your decent straight down like a parachute. Not supposed to land it that way unless in an emergency for it will take the tires off the rims. The gear flys in a narrow position and spreads out to take the shock. Also a risk of breaking the upper support and the the top of the gearlegs crashing thru the fuselage across your lap and breaking your legs. Palhal

Randy
01-10-2006, 11:13 PM
Hi all;
This thread is talking about Storch and Storch clones......
But this plane looks like the real deal to me....
The Dakota Coyote.
I believe this is Wayne Mackeys earlier design?
For Cub enthusiasts...this seems like a logical and practical alternative to a Storch.
Randy

http://supercub.org/gallery/view_photo.php?set_albumName=supercubs&id=abg

http://supercub.org/gallery/view_photo.php?set_albumName=supercubs&id=abd

http://supercub.org/gallery/view_photo.php?set_albumName=supercubs&id=abf

gpepperd
01-10-2006, 11:33 PM
Palhal, was this a real WWII storch you had? I'm seriously green with envy if it was. I'm thinking the PL-9 with an 0360 would make a pretty good performer but also have second thoughts about all the work when a cub or good 12 is not that far off. GP

Dave Calkins
01-10-2006, 11:40 PM
Wayne M.'s slatted Cub wing with TE camber sounds like it'll do what I'd want it to.

The numbers he's talking are phenominal.

As has been said before "...when Wayne or Jerry talk, people listen...".

DAVE

Gunny
01-11-2006, 06:46 AM
gpepperd - Don't know if you were aware of it or not but Paul Allen's private collection called the Flying Heritage Collection has an orginal Storch. They do offer tours and it might be worth checking out if you get down this way. The collection is located in Arlington, Washington. Here's a link to the website.

http://www.flyingheritage.com/TemplateTopImages.aspx?contentId=16

Mark Lund
01-11-2006, 01:54 PM
My brother's estate has a Slepcev Storch project for sale. The wings are 95% complete, fuselage 75%. Includes a 100 hp engine and Sensenich prop.

PM me with questions if you are interested.

Mark

palhal
01-11-2006, 03:23 PM
Palhal, was this a real WWII storch you had? I'm seriously green with envy if it was. I'm thinking the PL-9 with an 0360 would make a pretty good performer but also have second thoughts about all the work when a cub or good 12 is not that far off. GP GP-- Yes, it was a real Storch. It was a D model (Ambulance). The Confederate Aif Force owns it now. It is a huge airplane and it would never work in tight quarters like the DVD Long props and big rocks. Palhal