The free lunch [Archive]

Michael E. Butterfield

11-12-2003, 09:46 PM

Gunnys Cub is a little heavy but so am I... and old, just like his data plate. The fuselage is chrome moly instead of mild steel,that has to be more dense, and heavier. It has all of the braces to hold it together ie. X brace, tail stuff, 2000# do dahs, float fittings, baggage floor, extended baggage, than half inch tube where Piper put aluminum stringers on the bird cage. We're heavy with all the stuff to make her go on amphibs ie both pumps, plumbing, wiring and actuator. Than she has the McCauley Club out front. Marks wing is a little heavier than the stock, but what the leading edge does for the aircraft performance is well worth the penalty. That my excuse for Daiseys weight problem. I on the other hand like to eat... and would like to buy lunch for the person who can beat Gunny over the 50' obstacle at YKM.mb

zane

11-13-2003, 01:28 AM

MB your post has the tone of a babbling hobo reminiscing with himself of the glory days. Who you talkin to?

Steve Pierce

11-13-2003, 06:44 AM

He is challenging you to take your buddies Super Cub up to WA state and beat Gunnies (in some peoples minds) overweight SC over a 50' obstacle. If that is overweight with all that stuff the L18C I fly is way obese. 960 lbs with C90-12, lt. wt battery and starter, two 18 gallon wing tanks, underseat storage, saftey cables and 8:50s. I think I'm going to stick with the left wing tank, no electric on mine. I have a -12 but can add all those eminities at a later date. Supposedly left the factory at around 800 lbs. Anybuddy got any weights on a 90 hp SC?

FlipFlop

11-13-2003, 07:36 AM

Michael E. Butterfield

11-13-2003, 08:06 AM

I'm computer illiterate, and thouht I was posting on Poll: Wing selection for rebuild....mb

S2D

11-13-2003, 08:19 AM

Well I'm not going to fly all the way out there just to get a free lunch, but if you ever get to Montana with that lead sled, maybe you can buy me one here!! :P

Gunny

11-13-2003, 08:30 AM

removed

FlipFlop

11-13-2003, 08:40 AM

Mike,

You "babble" all you want.

For all you other "friendly" supercub.org types - yeah thats you Agent Smith and Cuby - Mike B is the A&P IA that built me one great SC. He was trying to post to continue the discussion on the weight of my rebuilt SC. Apparently it got posted here instead of under the "Wing Selection for Rebuild" thread. This explanation should help all you hot shot city types understand what us "hobos" is chattering about. I dead certain that none of you have ever made a single error in your entire lives so please try to forgive us "hobos" if we are worthy of forgiveness.

And, oh yeah.......did Mommy forget to teach you manners? Nice way to greet someone at supercub.org. there Agent Smith. You know, I could have said that your hobo post (Smith/TripSlip38) sounded like a smart axx young punk know it all post but I didn't do that now did I. If I was Mike after yours and Cuby's gracious welcome I wonder if I'd even consider posting here again.

Actually, my "smart axx" remark didn't have anything to do with Mike and was directed at my buddy Steve...

Steve Pierce

11-13-2003, 08:46 AM

I take offense to that Cuby. I'm not a "babbling hobo", hillbilly maybe hence my Tennessee roots.

Gunny

11-13-2003, 08:48 AM

removed

wilbur

11-13-2003, 08:49 AM

Good post Mike, regardless of where you put it. Keep em coming. The more input from you rebuilders, the better.

11-13-2003, 09:09 AM

Gunny

11-13-2003, 09:28 AM

removed

Crash

11-13-2003, 09:53 AM

I dealt with Mike Butterfield when he was at Cub Crafters and can vouch that he is a good guy. Welcome to the site Mike and best wishes now that you're apparently out on your own. Crash

supilot

11-13-2003, 10:45 AM

. .

Lawn Dart

11-13-2003, 11:55 AM

Ok, everybody take a deep breath and relax. Frequently on this site, humor is misconstrued as abuse, and vice versa, so take everything with a grain of salt.

Dangit Steve, I just finished boxing up a half dozen pups, now I gota unpack em. :x

Hang in there Mike, and keep telling yourself "there's gota be a pony in here somewhere" :lol:

zane

11-13-2003, 12:27 PM

Wow...that was incredible, like the scene in True Romance where all the mob guys and cops shoot each other...bullets whizzing across the room. I was just joshin ya Butterfield. I could listen to Super Cub babble all day.

And Gunny: Yes I am a smart a$$ young city punk. At least I am now. But I was raised in the backwoods just like ya'll polite types. Now that I am a cool, city elite hacker type, I find joy in ribbing with older flyboy geezers on the internet who share my passion for aviation. One of the things I appreciate about geezers is their great sense of humor. Mike would have enjoyed no less elbow had he wandered out of his tent and up to the campfire at a fly-in and unleashed his contextless spew. :D

Oh, and Gunny: That is a beautiful cub! Any more pics in the gallery?

Come back Mike!

diggler

11-13-2003, 12:35 PM

delete

Gunny

11-13-2003, 02:41 PM

removed

Speedo

11-13-2003, 03:01 PM

In addition to being a good wrench, Mike's a good instructor, too. He gave me my tailwheel endorsement, and taught me a lot of practical things that came in handy during my flight to AK in 2002. One of them was how to make the best use of the runway and taxiway configuration when landing in strong crosswinds: coming in to Edmonton City Centre the winds were 20, gusting to 30, and 40 degrees off the runway heading. Applying Mike's teachings, I flew my final nearly directly into the wind, aiming right at the intersection of two runways and a taxiway. The intersection created several hundred feet of useable asphalt. The wind was so strong that when I touched down I had a very short landing roll and needed to use power to continue rolling straight ahead onto the taxiway.

Rick Papp

11-13-2003, 08:09 PM

Hey Guys,
More wars have been started over misscommunications than from transgressions. We all have the same intrests here and we are independant thinkers (as most pilot types are). It is far better to listen closley,then comment, than to be heard loudly and and backpaddle. I better shut up because I'm sounding like a Democrat and that scares me. Peace to all!!! Rick

Michael E. Butterfield

11-13-2003, 09:08 PM

Sorry to cause a comotion, and thanks for putting up with a fat old guy. In the past Jim from CC and I have been allowed onto the runway as a flight, for a shoot out. We try to do it at high noon on Wednesday, and the winner gets the free lunch. Jim will tell you that he has never had to buy... but he might have to this time. We have invited the Husky guys, the Moutain Goat, and anyone flying a STOL type plane, but till now it has been just he and I. First off and to fifty feet gets the first catagory. We climb to two hundred feet and at the end of the runway go down wind in slow flight, and the fast guy has to land first. We do it three times and the best two out of three gets the free lunch. I know it all sounds silly, but we laugh alot, and a good time is had by all. Coffee pot is always on, ya'll come.mb

Steve Pierce

11-13-2003, 09:18 PM

Mike sounds like my kind of fun. Maybe I can get up there some day.

Roger Gross

11-13-2003, 09:22 PM

Mike,

I don't think you are the one that has to apologize for anything. I enjoyed hearing your thoughts on where the weight was added on Gunny's cub. Also, I wanted to thank you for spending an hour of your time on the telephone a couple of weeks ago talking about the slotted wing. Spoke with Gunny last week and it sounds like "Daisy" is a great flying cub. Keep us posted on next Wednesday's shootout with Richmond.

You guys get down here, I will buy the lunch.

Later, Roger

Crash

11-14-2003, 10:00 AM

Old Geezers!, Old Geezers!! Trip Slip if I can get up out of this chair and find my walker, I'm gonna come over there and kick the wooster out of you. :lol: Young whipper snappers. Crash

kase

11-14-2003, 12:10 PM

Hi Mike,

We should set up a ribbon like the picture below. How many hours did you have in rebuilding gunnys plane?

http://www.supercub.org/upload/ribbon.jpg

zane

11-14-2003, 09:55 PM

That ribbon setup is sweet. I wish they had one set up like that during my flight training for the shorts and obstacle clearance lessons. Looks like fun practice.

Z

PA12driver

11-15-2003, 02:01 AM

Welcome Mike! I can vouch for Mikes talent, I also know that he knows how to fly, I also know that with enough horsepower you can get off in that Yakima heat!

I am surprised them Tower boys will still let you and Jim play like in the good ol days, I hope to get up soon and play too.

Darn all that ribbing and I missed it! See it isn't just me and Diggler??

Darn Crash, you must have had a heck of a week at the Shop to have that much piss in vinegar!! Got that hotrod cub flying yet!!

Steve Pierce, Time you make a trek out west and skip that Sun and fun zoo, (what ya think??)

We could have a heck of a party this summer??

Tim

Steve Pierce

11-15-2003, 06:44 AM

Had to go back last year after the 2002 mishap. The thing about S&F is I get to spend a week with my folks, whom I don't get to spend much time with these day with a back drop of awesome airplanes. Lots of fond memories over the past 12 years, well except for my stay at Lakeland Regional Medical Center anyway.

I do want to get back West. I really enjoyed the flying I did up there on the way back from Vancouver.

Michael E. Butterfield

11-15-2003, 09:48 AM

Hi Tim! Most of the time I call the guys in the tower short people in a tall building with a bad attitude, but our guys are very special. They do put up with a lot, and I'm probably the only pilot on the field who has their number on speed dial. Not only do they allow two planes as a flight to shoot it out, but we have a figure 8 pattern where we take of on 27 climb to 50 or 100 feet, turn downind and land on 4, take off, turn downwind and land on 27, and so on, never getting any higher than that. In one hour you can build up an incredible number of touch and goes. Last year we cut 27 and 4 to the width of the crossing runways, and cut the pattern alltitude to 20 feet. What a kick in the butt. They like nothing more than to have 2 or 3 planes doing the same thing, cause they stand up there and conduct with the arm motions and everything and rack up the operations. The ribbon idea looks real cool, and we do have an abandoned runway where we used to pick up and drop the banner that would be perfect. Mr Examiner is from the Tri-Cities and says that he has never seen that kind of flying allowed in class D. Any one out there as blessed as we are here at YKM? Y'all come.mb

11-15-2003, 02:08 PM

Mike,

We shoot low figure eights here in KC (MKC) all the time. Tower loves them, then we touch down twice on each pass. 60 touch and goes in an hour is the max so far I think.

Today I departed across the runway sideways. They just giggled.

sj

StewartB

11-15-2003, 06:45 PM

Lake Hood controllers are among the best. I've been at the ballpark for a west on the lake (one mile base, essentially), 4 or 5 guys taxing and sequenced for take-off, and I was number 6 for the water to land. A wee bit busy in anybody's book, and at Hood, not that unusual. Too congested for fun and games, but those controllers....they're good.
SB

Michael E. Butterfield

11-15-2003, 10:59 PM

When we take of across the runway, the tower here says"Short runway, but pretty wide...eh? The one I really like is "remain vfr" when it is CAVU... what is with that... there is not a cloud in the sky...remain vfr...I can do that... but oh there I go again rambling like a hobo. Hats off to the controller that has to put up with the likes of us...eh?mb

zane

11-15-2003, 11:13 PM

Mike,

You will go down in supercub.org history as the guy who spawned a 2-page thread from babble, and became the hero of every pilot who as ever longed to really enjoy closed traffic. Hope you enjoy it here.

:) Zane

kase

11-15-2003, 11:16 PM

The reason you are told "remain vfr" when it is cavu is to remind you that your are responsible for your own aircraft/terrian seperation. VFR towers are only responsible for runway seperation. Chances are you will be told this also in a radar enviroment incase you have a mid air with somebody not observed on radar etc. CYA for ATC

Torch

11-16-2003, 01:55 AM

Can't we all just get along? :bad-words:

Michael E. Butterfield

11-16-2003, 07:16 PM

I see, just a CYA issue. Interesting, always wondered, but didn't know why that was done. Well I for one am always looking for terain and other A/C, especially those that aren't moving in the wind shield and getting bigger at my allitude. That one gets my attention. Fly safe and have more fun.mb

Jerry Burr

11-16-2003, 09:24 PM

Hi guys. I haven't been around for awhile but I couldn't help noticing that the ribbons in the ribbon picture are blowing the same way as the airplane is flying. Or is it my puter. :wink: Jerry.

diggler

11-16-2003, 09:35 PM

delete

11-17-2003, 07:20 AM

Jerry,

The supercub with all its speed has created a vaccum which caused the little flags to fly the wrong way... Ok, probably not...

sj

Michael E. Butterfield

11-17-2003, 08:45 AM

No Diggler you are not crazy... That is about where we are with Gunnys Cub around a thousand, cause we replaced the wing, fuselage, boot cowl, panel, and engine. Not a whole lot of stuff to clean, repair, and paint. There is no small job on any plane, and every plane is very labor intensive. If it were easy...everyone would be doing it. Let's all have more fun.mb

Michael E. Butterfield

11-17-2003, 08:36 PM

Welcome back Jerry Burr! Hope you are having as much fun as we are. What good timing your being here right now. I have this project that I would like to get you involved in. I'm sure that Jim from CC will want to be there too. If you are interested would ya call me please.mb

kase

11-20-2003, 10:18 AM

just a CYA issue

10 years ago I was sued for negligence in a Bonaza crash where the pilot hit a hill top and exploded into a million pieces but no fire. He called 30 miles out wanting a SVFR clearance. I couldnt give it to him at the time because of other traffic. I told him to " continue inbound, maintain VFR" . Weather was 700 OVC 7 miles. 12 miles from the airport he clips a hill top. Appears to of been running on auto pilot probably IFR conditions beacuse his altitude never varied. Anyhow they tried to hang me since I told him to "continue inbound". Claiming if I didnt say that he would of turned around. I said he knew the weather since he had the ATIS and would of turned around it it was to bad and since he was instructed to maintain vfr it was his reponsibility for terrian/obstruction clearnace etc. If I wouldnt of said that the FAA would of paid millions to the guys family. If you ever get in front of a lawyer its not much fun even if you did nothing wrong. They ask you the same question 7 different ways trying to ruin your credibility etc. CYA is a good thing wether your a pilot. atc, or a mechanic.

FlipFlop

11-20-2003, 10:25 AM

just a CYA issue
If you ever get in front of a lawyer its not much fun even if you did nothing wrong. They ask you the same question 7 different ways trying to ruin your credibility etc. CYA is a good thing wether your a pilot. atc, or a mechanic.

Good advice Kase...

Steve Pierce

11-20-2003, 01:00 PM

Ditto.

Wayne Mackey

11-20-2003, 08:50 PM

Mike B,
Will be traveling though your area some time next month. If it works out I would like to
stop by and ckeck out the sloted cub. Sounds like a good plane. I found the same
thing with my slats in that the added weight was more than made up for with the added
performance. Wayne

Gunny

11-20-2003, 09:37 PM

removed

Wayne Mackey

11-21-2003, 09:12 AM

Gunny'
I will be there, Mother is in Yakima so I have to stop Wayne

Gunny

11-21-2003, 11:20 AM

removed

Michael E. Butterfield

11-21-2003, 08:35 PM

Coffee pot is on. Y'all come.mb

Michael E. Butterfield

02-02-2004, 10:21 AM

I am having a real hard time getting someone to buy me lunch, but Earl Barnes from CC did a BFR with me on Saturday in Gunnys Cub, and some people might find his comments interesting. Earl is the guy you talk to when you call looking for parts or mods, and when he isn't there it is because he is out putting the required five hours on the brand new planes. First thing we did was the take off at a forty five degree deck angle, climbing like a home sick angel. Then we pushed over at 500 feet and went right to 110 MPH at 2,500 RPM. Killed the top speed loss rumor right there... Did some demonstrations of stupidity at altitude to show how ignorant we will have to be to kill ourselves, then back to YKM for the figure eight pattern. Earl response, "this is amazing... I'm simply amazed". Good choice of words Earl! Am told that this wing works best when heavily loaded, and would like to weigh two Cubs to 2200# for a shoot out. Gunny has left his plane with us for the winter and everyone is welcome to come to YKM and fly her. She is a real sweetie and her name is Daisy. Fly safe and have more fun.mb

cobblemaster

02-03-2004, 08:48 PM

I wonder what Richmond thinks of that.

Steve Pierce

02-03-2004, 09:01 PM

Mark it up and sell it.

Michael E. Butterfield

02-04-2004, 09:28 AM

I've invited Jim over to fly Daisy, but he is a very busy guy, and hasn't made it yet. I'm sure that when he does he will find like everyone else that this wing does produce more lift than the stock wing. Jim and I have done shoot outs in the past and had a good time doing it. I think it would be a good comparison, as he is a very capable pilot, and I would be happy to trade back and forth to rule out pilot technique. The Dakota Cub slotted wing is the wing of choice on our Bushmaster as we are going to have Cub like performance in a four place. Again, the coffee pot is on and all are welcome to come and experience for them selves. Saturdays are turning into a real social event as the weather is turning and the pilots are coming out to see what is new. Low and slow, power back in the turns.mb

CptKelly

02-04-2004, 03:56 PM

Guys,
Why are all of "Gunnys" posts "removed"?? Did he hack off the moderator?

Mike in NC

02-04-2004, 04:03 PM

Gunny removed his own posts by editing them.

sj

scubber

02-04-2004, 08:27 PM

Just "re-read" this thread as it was on the home page again. I can't add to the challenge but as for Trip Slip 38's comment on the post showing the "ribbon". . . . It appears to be a scan of the Super Cub brochure (Dark Blue Cover) from the early 60's. The tree line is most likely along the river bank at Lock Haven. And in reply to Steve P about weights of other 95's. Before engine upgrade, our was around yours (948) with hydra sorbs, elec, both tanks and other goodies. I would believe it was much heavier as it had never been on scales since the factory. Looks like ours came from the factory at 921 lbs. (1959). Larry C.

Torch

02-04-2004, 10:42 PM

Ok, everybody take a deep breath and relax. Frequently on this site, humor is misconstrued as abuse, and vice versa, so take everything with a grain of salt.

Gunny, I am about the "uncoolest" person on earth (cub wize anyway), so if you leave, I'll have to go with you.

Mike, welcome to the site, thanks for your post, and don't let this thread discourage you!

sj

Steve is right. It is really hard for one's sense of humor to come across on the internet. We are all guilty of jumping ahead of ourselves sometimes. I really like joking around. My cub is heavy because she has lots of instruments in her. I have found that her instruments have come in a lot more handy than being light weight. I will take my cub's fat azz and my fat azz any day. I have been in bad weather several times and Torch has always brought me home.

Torch/Don

Torch

02-04-2004, 10:45 PM

Guys,
Why are all of "Gunnys" posts "removed"?? Did he hack off the moderator?

Mike in NC

I have never, ever done that. Hehehehehehehehehhe. Happens to everyone if you post enough. Gunny, keep the posts coming. I have erased a few myself but it was all in good fun.