Shooting Circuits

I have a few questions about shooting circuits and practicing short field landings. I like to practice my short field landing and take-offs. I practice off airport in a large grass field with good approaches at either end with no obstacles. I want to keep things fairly safe, but I also want to land fairly short. My questions are:

1) Is this type of activity hard on my engine, and if so are there ways to reduce the fatigue on my engine: (power adjustments, OAT temperatures, time sent per session, doing 100ft circuits to reduce climbing too long, etc…)
2) For you guy’s that do a lot of off airport landings: what are your techniques for checking out new strips and what type of things do you look for?
3) What techniques do you use for judging lengths of intended landing surfaces, or does this just come from experience?
4) What type of exercises can pilots do to sharpen their landing skills?


I know there are a lot of questions and if you choose answer one or all. I also read that great article S.T.O.L Operations by Mike Vivion of Fairbanks wrote that was posted earlier in Tips and Tricks. Any advice would be helpful.

Thanks, Ramchaser

Tell us about the plane you are practicing in? Also what are your qualifications? There is a lot of variables to consider.

Tim

Try to make power adjustments as smooth as possible (always), but expecially in cold weather. You will put more wear on your engine, but that will be off set by the increase in your piloting skills. Always practice and keep your skills sharp, no matter how much experience you have.

A whole book could be written to answer your questions, and luckily, it has. Read F E Potts, Guide to Bushflying. You will find the answers to your questions, and lots of other info you need there.

Tim,


I own a J3 Cub with an 85hp engine with the old 25x11x4 tires, with a 3200 Scott tailwheel. I have approx. 550 hours on this aircraft. As a Wildlife Researcher I have a unique opportunity of flying with very experienced pilots in various different aircraft locating radio collared animals like grizzlies, wolverines, cougars and different ungulates. Tracking these animals brings us into all different types of terrain and environmental conditions. I feel quite confident flying in mountainous conditions but most of these pilots do not push the envelope when it comes to short field operations, but I have grained a lot of valuable experience from flying with these pilots on a regular basis. I have read F.E. Potts Guide To Bush Flying, and Sparky Imeson’s Mountain Flying Bible and both have been a great help. What I was wondering: are there other techniques from other experienced pilots for sharpening your skills. I am a low time pilot and want to work my way in slow to be proficient at short field operations so any advise is appreciated

Cheers, Ramchaser

The only way you are going to get good at landing short is time in the seat. Find a way that works for you and practice two hours a day just doing takeoffs and landings. In a year or so it will start to come to you. It may not take that long but there is no substatute for time in the seat.

Tim

The classic Stick and Rudder is a very good place to start. It was written in the '40's(?) when the convential gear was most common. Durning this time all of the trainers were J3, taylorcraft, champs and the like. The book goes over AOA at lenght and once you understand this you are on your way to good flying technique. I often refer to this book when I feel my technique is getting sloppy. Probably the best part of the book is the chapter that describes the approach to landing stall. A most educational read.pak

short landings

One of the first things to consider when doing short landings is picking your touch down point. Alot of pilots do not pick a specific spot to touch down. Start doing this and pactice hitting the spot every time and you'll be on your way.

I still have some problem with this when landing off airport. Referrance points look different when on final approach than when flying overhead looking at the landing place. Luckly I have been close enough so far.

As far as length, I overfly a new spot at 70knts and if it takes 5 seconds or more I can fit. Slope can make a big difference.

Really alot of things to consider.

Don

Practice, practice, practice it makes a difference. Read everything you can listen to anybody with some experience, it all helps but nothing makes up for stick time. Conditions vary, one strip can be easy on a cold day with a headwind and a pig on a hot day with a tailwind. The only thing that really helps your knowledge is knowing you and your aircrafts limits.

I don't have a lot of SuperCub time but a bit on most other sorts of tailwheels, anything from Tiger moth to Turbine Airtractors with most of my tailwheel time on Beavers. In 22 years and 15000+ hours I still consider myself a student pilot, everyday different, everyday something else learned. I'm not trying to brag about experience just saying whatever you know you never know it all. You could fly all your life and still be learning for a couple more lifetimes.

I think the most important thing is to enjoy your flying, it's the best way for a different view of the world.

I'm not a high time cub pilot. I only have about 600 hours in J-3's, mostly a C-85-12F while doing search and rescue flying. I wouldn't say that I was ever very proficient, but I don't fly as well as I used to, because I quit flying while my daughters were growing up (lack of money, not safety issues). Kept my planes though and started back after they were grown. I still have more landings and takeoffs off-airport than on. In an unfamiliar short field, I'd usually make a pass at above powerline height, looking for powerlines, ditches, fences, logs, stumps, tire ruts, etc. (there were no rocks in the region where I flew). I'd then make a very low pass to get a visual feel for the runway itself, still looking for ground obstructions. On the real landing pass, I used quite a bit of power, so that I was well under power-off stall speed on short final. When I was a few feet short of the touchdown spot, I'd chop power, settle in and brake hard as I could without nosing over, sometimes turning the plane near the end of the rollout. During takeoff, if the area was wide enough, I'd start my roll transverse to the takeoff direction, accelerating and doing a hard turn to align the plane for takeoff. Generally, I'd let the tail float, neither lifting the tail nor trying to hold it down till I was near liftoff speed, generally taking off in near three-point attitude. Note that landing on top of river levees requires a somewhat different technique, because of the reduced ground effect and the erratic rolling tendency due to gusting crosswinds trying to lift one wing while dropping the other. Generally, I'd come in with considerable power, align with the levee, hold power about 6" up until I felt a gust dying, then chop power, settle in, and brake hard in an attempt to get slowed down before the next gust hit. Doing circuits like this is hard on the engine, but not as hard as whacking a tree, ditch, or powerline due to insufficient short field practice.
JimC
P.S. After parking the plane in the boonies for any length of time, always look for snakes and critters in the plane before taking off again. This is the voice of experience speaking.

Safe practice

Ramchaser, Some of the best tmies I have had in practice is when a few freinds and
I would take our planes out to a very large gravel bar and play. We would mark out a
airstrip by kicking out an outline of an airstrip about 20' buy 400' in the middle of this big
bar, no danger if you screw up. We would come in low, high,from the side,every
way we could think of. when we had that down we would make the strip shorter,
narrower, put in a dogleg, what ever we felt like. We put in many saturday's and
evennings this of type practice . This is also good family outings.

Stolmaster Montana

Ramchaser!

All good advice from other posts! As Wayne has stated, start out in an area that offers some "forgiveness" so you can work on technique and recover safely from failures in same.

I HIGHLY recommend finding a "cub pilot" that is very experienced in the type of flying that you want to learn. Trust me they are not all qualified to teach short field/ short takeoff, bush type flying just cause they have "lots of time in type.

When you do find that someone, observe closely, study their techniques and then practice and ask for their critique. I have recently begun to Video tape my "mentor" (yea I still have a coach) I have then had him video me doing exactly the same proceedures and compared, tweaked and will continue doing that!

We talk to each other on the radio during practice, we point out winds, obstacles, and remind each other of limitations. WE also continue to stress safety and NOT pushing beyond our DAILY limits. Some days feel good, some don't.

Hope this helps,

Tim

Landing a -3

Hi Ramchaser. You have a great short field bird there. It just has to be flown a lot differently than a S. Cub. Usually your problem will be making an approach at minimum airspeed and hitting a downdraft. You add power, the motor stumbles, and when it catches you get a tremendous surge of power (haha) and then you go above your glideslope and it just gets worse from there. What would be nice is more control. I used this method for years and years, before I got flaps, and I still use it now, even with full flaps down. Try it out, while you, PRACTICE, PRACTICE.
Get a little altitude to play with the idea. When I say left full lock slip, I mean the left rudder against the firewall and enough aileron to make it a forward slip. It will be nearly full aileron. Half lock slip will be approximately half that ammount. Soooo reduce power to around 1200 and slow down. Then go into a left half lock slip. Hold the power and vary the slip to control the glide angle. To come down add more slip. Get It? Pretend you are on middle final approach set up in this condition. #1. Now a strong downdraft gets you. Simply roll out of the slip, and ease the nose up a bit to stay on your glide path. When through it, ease back into the slip. If it is really a whopper, ease on full power and go around. #2. Now pretend a updraft hits you. Leave the power where it is and go into a full lock slip. Where there is up, there is usually down and you are going to find it next. If you do find it just roll out of the slip as before. You have to keep some power on these little C. motors. To keep the carb heat warm and so they will take power when asked. (always gently). In doing this you are using the side of the fuselage as a variable air brake. Keep the approach speed at what you usually use now or a little slower. Roll out of the slip and chop power and it will flare pretty as you please. I tried to stall it in the slip and never could. Try yours at altitude just to be sure. On take-off, if you are on anything but mud,snow or that sort of thing, Just cram on full forward stick with the power. The drag of the elevators, is nothing compared to the wings if you are on 25's. And it's always nice to see where you are going. Have fun. Jerry.

OK, here's a question that must have been asked here many times: SC with flaps, drop half or full flap, Xwind from the left, run out of aileron due to the obstruction from the flap lever. Happened to me this weekend.

Any suggestions beyond simply going flapless?

BCB

Personally I like to use full flaps. If the wind is blowing strong enough that you may run out of aileron then I use a different runway or land on the runway at an angle or use the grass. The only time I may not make full use of the flaps is if the wind is really howlin' right down the runway.

flap handle mod

This thing with the flap handle is a problem for me because of my size 6'2" 230+ .
With my flap up all the way not enough room for my leg between the handle and
full left stick. I have many times taken my foot off the rudder so i could push the stick
under my leg. I do not like this or addvise. Since then I have started modifying my flap handles. I cut off about 4" of the handle and butten rod. It is a simple fix and works well.
There is a little more to pull but knot much. The last three planes i did this to had long
flaps and ailerons that drooped 22 deg. and no one complained about flap handle load.
A feild appoval should not be a problem for the only difference is more lode in your
hand. Try this it really works well.
Wayne

Wayne,
When you reference long flaps, what length are you talking about? I don't think you?re referencing the tiny inboard extensions referenced often on this web site. I will assume you're flap extensions are outboard a couple feet. Please clarify this for your readers. I?ve always been a big proponent of long flaps on a properly configured Cub.

Long flaps

These three planes all had different size flaps. The first one had 18" added outboard.
The second was a brand new set Dakota cub wings with about 7' 6" flaps. The last
one I did a little different I used a standard 18 aileron and hangers and falsespar.
These where all experimental cubs. The first two also had movable leading edge
slats. Wayne

I only want to address the question of judging the length of the landing spot. Here's where modern technology beats all... I use a handheld gps and fly over the intended landing spot at 70 mph (61 kts) "GROUND SPEED". Each second equals a hair over 100'. Just count; one thousand one, one thousand two. Practice the cadence before you leave while watching a clock with a second hand. This proves to be extremely accurate.
Best regards. barefootpilot (cliff)

I am performing it in a similar way. I have made a tabulation for the different airspeeds (60-80mls) because it is mostly to hard to keep a certain speed. I fly over the desired aerea up and down and count the seconds. With 70 mls + - 5mls airspeed both sides and 5 seconds for me it is safe to land. It is more than 400ft.